K Scan and how to connect it?

[cal_tony]

I down loaded the K scan EFI software from the GG spain site just to see what it was like. Read the PDF and installed the software. It is exclusively for the GG system and is read through a serial cable to your computer. However, I haven't found any info on buying or making the cable. Is there a way to connect this software to the bike?

Tony

 

[iancp5]

I down loaded the K scan EFI software from the GG spain site just to see what it was like. Read the PDF and installed the software. It is exclusively for the GG system and is read through a serial cable to your computer. However, I haven't found any info on buying or making the cable. Is there a way to connect this software to the bike?

Tony

Does it give a spec on the cable / connectors - maybe it's a standard PC type. E.g. RS232

 

[GavGav]

I down loaded the K scan EFI software from the GG spain site

Do you have a link?
I could not see anything on the http://www.gasgasmotos.es/eng/frame.htm site

 

[cal_tony]

Here is where I downloaded it from.
http://www.gasgasmotos.es/rcs/manuales/endurofse.htm

In looking at the software, it seems to do everything needed to adjust the EFI. I have not read everything but after looking at the PDF and seeing that there were multiple tables re. the EFI, I just began to look for hookup instructions. It indicated a serial port connection and that's as far as I got. Since I just purchased the GG 450 I wasn't sure if this was something everyone was using. I looked the the threads on this site and found nothing re. Kscan so I thought I would ask about it here.

Tony

 

[ferguscawley]

To connect Kscan you need a special factory supplied cable that connects to a 6 pin connector under the seat. I'm sure the electronics gurus can figure out a way to make their own.

The version of Kscan that you downloaded allows very limited adjustment of the bike's parameters. Fuelling and ignition timing etc cannot be adjusted with this verson. Only the factory can do this. The version delivered to importers/dealers does not allow fuelling adjustments either.

Kscan does allow you to test individual sensors, activate the fuel pump, fire the spark plug, fire the injector, calibrate the tps zero setting etc.

Hope this helps

Fergus

 

[Qui-gon]

I think you will find that the Kscan only works with the later 2008? and on FSRs with the Kokusan fuel injection. For older models with Magnet Marelli you will need the vastly overpriced Technoresearch stuff or the older crappy MDST software which only runs on win95/98 also written by Technoresearch . Either of these versions only allow 1 adjustment (fuel load) and and some diagnostics.

 

[mike989]

Qui,
What are the alternatives for tunning the FI on the 02-07 FSE/FSR. I have the basic Technoresearch stuff. I didn't think it was over priced at $195.
I'd like to be able to adjust the fuel values across the entire rpm range, the way the Cannondale owners could.
I realize the two systems are very different.

 

[GMP]

I have a Ducati Hypermotard with an open loop performance Magnetti Marelli ECU, and use the Technoresearch VDST-S tool. I also owned a Cannondale and had the Optimum Technologies tool for that. I'm not specificly familiar with the K-Scan tool, or Kokusan injection, but they are all somewhat similar.

A few points here:

With regard to the VDST-S and Magnetti Marelli injection, the software is specific to one family of ECU, but an indefinate number of ECUs (bikes) in that family. You can do basic diagnostics, clear codes, set TPS, and adjust fuel trim, but the exact options depend on the ECU family and version. For example you cannot adjust fuel trim on a Ducati OEM closed loop ECU as it locked in that mode by the factory for emmisions compliance. Fuel "trim" is basically a variable fixed offset of injector pulse width that is applied across the entire map, therefore it has a greater effect at idle and low speed (narrow width) conditions, and less at high demand (wider pulse width) conditions. This can be observed by changing trim values and noting the pulse width change. The map in the MM ECU is not available for change, although it does reside in flash memory, this portion of memory is locked to all but the factory programming tool.

Optimum Technologies offered two tools for the Cannondale Sagem ECU. The basic tool was approx $250 and allowed diagnostics, TPS, injector offset(same as "trim"), and also allowed the downloading of pre-built maps files to the ECU. It's license was locked to one Sagem ECU. It DID NOT allow editing of the map in any way, for that you had to buy the high end tool for over $1K. This tool could do everything, including blow the bike up if you did not know exactly what you were doing.

All the tools included cables. These are more than just serial cables. There is a small inline box in addition to the specific connector. I suspect this is a level translator for the CAN bus that the ECU uses for comms to other parts of the system (like the dash or instrument cluster), I'm sure this was the case with the Cannondale. I havn't opend up the cable from my VDST-S to see yet, but since you can download the software for free, and it looks for a cable, I suspect that there is more to it. Its possible that the Kokusan interface is RS-232, I just don't know. If so it would be easy to make up a cable.

 

[Qui-gon]

serial cable and what's in it

Hi
For anyone that is interested the serial cable I have for the older MDST software is a simple rs232 level converter. It takes power from either the second black 2 pin plug at the bike end of from pins 7 and 8 on the DB9 serial connector from the pc. Also in the box is a 5v voltage regulator to supply the standard TTL to rs232 convertor chip used for received data from the ECU. Transmitting data is achieved by a single transistor which switches between 5v and 0v. Both transmit and receive data are referenced to a common ground as is the regulator.
Since most automotive interfaces ( CAN, OBDII, J1708 etc) use a 2 wire bus and special chips to convert the data, my guess would be that the ECU port is nothing more complicated than a simple rs232 serial interface which uses TTL levels (0 - 5V). Its the cheapest way when only 1 electronic unit is involved.
As time permits I intend to check out the communications between the pc and the ECU to see if it uses any of the common automotive codes and commands to get a better idea of how it works.

 

[mike989]

For older models with Magnet Marelli you will need the vastly overpriced Technoresearch stuff or the older crappy MDST software which only runs on win95/98 also written by Technoresearch .

Qui,
What is the alternative software for tunning the 02-07FSE/FSR's? The factory, and technoresearch are the only two I know of.
If there's more, please chime in.

 

[Qui-gon]

There is no alernative at the moment...except a second user version if you can find one. The reason I consider it overpriced is simple. It is not an end user product. It does a family of ECUs and is more suited to a dealer who may be working on a variety of makes (Ducati, GG and I believe HD). The interface cable I have could be made for less than $20 so you are paying $180+ for a piece of software to make 1 adjustment and check a few other settings.
The Kscan software, however, is a free download along with a couple of maps.