45mm shivers no adjustments??

darren

darren

New member
I have a GG EC250 1998 with 45mm Shivers off an 07 bike.

When i first fitted them the Rebound and Compression adjusters made noticable difference when used.

I did Strip and service them when i fitted them and again 6months later.

At present winding the comp and reb adjusters fully clockwise there is no change in the fork character. In fact it is like riding a pogo stick at the mo.

I stripped one fork leg and checked the shim stack was intact, ( i did not bother to strip the other due to the fact they are both the same)

I was wondering what could be wrong. The marzocchi site talks about Inner rod pin blocked. Blocked compression and Contaminated oil.

Would these problems affect both settings? comp and reb
I know the oil is not contaminated.
Blocked compression would that affect rebound also?

With the inner rod pin I assume that would be the rod that sits in the tube which the rebound stack is attached to?

Also is the inner rod supposed to have a point on it? if it is then that could be my problem as mine looks fairly flat.

I wondered if the rebound piston seal/bush maybe was worn and allowing oil to pass around it instead of through it. But would that also affect the compression?

any help much appreciated. The manual i was looking at was on the website below.

http://www.marzocchi.co.uk/techinfo.html
 
I stripped the forks today and thoroughly cleaned out everything. The forks were quite clean. The bottom valve was clean and free of obstructions, and the taper valve was clear and free.

I did notice that the check valve has additional shims on and the rebound stack is stock for the 07 forks.

I am at a loss now as i still have no noticable adjustments on comp and rebound.

I think they may need to go to a specialist if i get no help here.
 
Thanks nick.

The oil i am sure is and was ok as i had no problem when i first changed the oil Jan 09, and it is the same oil as i put in after teardown.

The Rebound piston seal i thought could be the problem but how would i know? Also would it be too much of a coincidence that the seal has gone on both legs at the same time?

thanks for the reply.
darren
 
I don't know, but if they were working before you rebuilt them and aren't now, then it must be fault you have introduced.

Did they bleed ok? Mid valve working ok?
 
Sorry bad explanation.

Feb 09 I bought them second hand. Stripped and cleaned. on completion they were working 100%

Dec 09 Stripped cleaned etc. no probs.

April 10 (Day before Enduro) I had been noticing in practice less feeling on front end so i thought i would add some rebound (on clickers) they did not respond. Checked compression and rebound fully in and fully out. no difference is felt.???
Rode the enduro with the front end acting like a pogo stick.
 
Last edited:
darren said:
Sorry bad explanation.

Feb 09 I bought them second hand. Stripped and cleaned. on completion they were working 100%

Dec 09 Stripped cleaned etc. no probs.

April 10 (Day before Enduro) I had been noticing in practice less feeling on front end so i thought i would add some rebound (on clickers) they did not respond. Checked compression and rebound fully in and fully out. no difference is felt.???
Rode the enduro with the front end acting like a pogo stick.
Click to expand...

IMHO, the rebound stack need to be stiffened up (a lot) specially the h/s, as well as removing any bleed shims.
 
moto9 said:
IMHO, the rebound stack need to be stiffened up (a lot) specially the h/s, as well as removing any bleed shims.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the reply.

I just cant understand why it was fine before but not now?

Which part of the stack is the H/S? I think there is only about 5 shims on the rebound side.

I dont think there is a bleed shim on the rebound.

There is on the compression i will have to post up the shim stacks tomorrow.

darren
 
I have been messing with my suspension settings to the extent of it almost driving me insane...

First, check that you dont have a flat front tire(or too low air pressure). This will make the bike feel like the forks are broken.

Second, have you been moving your clickers on rear shock? This can also mess things up very bad.

good luck
 
darren said:
Thanks for the reply.

I just cant understand why it was fine before but not now?

Which part of the stack is the H/S? I think there is only about 5 shims on the rebound side.

I dont think there is a bleed shim on the rebound.

There is on the compression i will have to post up the shim stacks tomorrow.

darren
Click to expand...

So , the forks were fine before you worked on them?
If so...then I would assume something was not assembled right, and/or damaged, as mentioned, a seal etc.
In that case the only way to check would be to disassemble the fork and do a complete inspection.

But I do know from my own experience the 08 Marz 45's had a too soft rebound stack, even for the stock spring...again IMHO
 
bergerhag said:
I have been messing with my suspension settings to the extent of it almost driving me insane...

First, check that you dont have a flat front tire(or too low air pressure). This will make the bike feel like the forks are broken.

Second, have you been moving your clickers on rear shock? This can also mess things up very bad.

good luck
Click to expand...

I know what you mean with the messin around.

Tire pressure is 14psi

the rear shock is set to stock settings and has not been touched.
 
moto9 said:
So , the forks were fine before you worked on them?
If so...then I would assume something was not assembled right, and/or damaged, as mentioned, a seal etc.
In that case the only way to check would be to disassemble the fork and do a complete inspection.

But I do know from my own experience the 08 Marz 45's had a too soft rebound stack, even for the stock spring...again IMHO
Click to expand...

The reason i stripped them was because i had no change to the fork characteristics when i adjusted the clickers.

I think it has been a progressive thing that i had not noticed untill recently.

For a year now i have not touched the suspension settings. Every thing was set up to standard settings, static sag. race sag. Clickers front and rear.

What i was trying to say in my first post is that when i first got the forks stripped and cleaned re assembled. All the clickers made noticable difference when adjusted fully in and out. Just by pushing down on the bars and releasing the rebound would be noticably slower and compression noticably harder.

From then i left the clickers alone as it felt spot on.
 
darren said:
I wondered if the rebound piston seal/bush maybe was worn and allowing oil to pass around it instead of through it. But would that also affect the compression?
Click to expand...
sorry for not reading your post thoroughly. Yes a worn inner tube seal would affect compression too. That is the piston that drives the suspension fluid through the compression valve/shim stack. If it fails, both circuits will degrade
 
bergerhag said:
sorry for not reading your post thoroughly. Yes a worn inner tube seal would affect compression too. That is the piston that drives the suspension fluid through the compression valve/shim stack. If it fails, both circuits will degrade
Click to expand...

Thanks bergerhag

I am glad you said that i just got off the phone to GasGas.
I have ordered two Piston rings for the rebound piston and also two o-rings for the compression piston.

Hopefully i will receive these tommorow and update once i have a result.
 
Shim stack

I know its a little off the original thread i may also post this as a new thread, i have listed my shim stacks below just to see what response is received, and mabe i can make some adjustments accordingly while the forks receive the new rebound piston ring.

Some of the shim sizes seem a little odd compared to others i have seen posted see what you think.

I am 76kg + kit
Average clubman not worried about comfort just speed and stability.

NOTE i have done nothing with the shim stacks.


Rebound

Spring
15x0.3
15x0.2
15x0.3
22x0.3
11x0.2
Piston
21x0.1
19x0.1
17x0.1
15x0.1


Compression

Spring
22x0.3
Piston
11x0.2
22x0.12
11x0.2
20x0.12
19x0.1
11x0.1
18x0.1
17x0.1
16x0.16
15x0.2
12x.12

As i said some of the shims are odd (0.12)

Reading other posts on the site i thought mabe pulling the comp piston bleed shim 11x0.2 and also the first on the check valve (11x.02)
I cant be too radical as i only have the shims listed to play with.
 
Last edited:
darren said:
I know its a little off the original thread i may also post this as a new thread, i have listed my shim stacks below just to see what response is received, and mabe i can make some adjustments accordingly while the forks receive the new rebound piston ring.

Some of the shim sizes seem a little odd compared to others i have seen posted see what you think.

I am 76kg + kit
Average clubman not worried about comfort just speed and stability.

NOTE i have done nothing with the shim stacks.


Rebound

Spring
15x0.3
15x0.2
15x0.3
22x0.3
11x0.2
Piston
21x0.1
19x0.1
17x0.1
15x0.1


Compression

Spring
22x0.3
Piston
11x0.2
22x0.12
11x0.2
20x0.12
19x0.1
11x0.1
18x0.1
17x0.1
16x0.16
15x0.2
12x.12

As i said some of the shims are odd (0.12)

Reading other posts on the site i thought mabe pulling the comp piston bleed shim 11x0.2 and also the first on the check valve (11x.02)
I cant be too radical as i only have the shims listed to play with.
Click to expand...

Looks like the standard set up to me, I think making the changes you mentioned would be a good start.

Out of interest, how much were the seals from GGUK?
 
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