I love my Gas Gas but?

[moto9]

So, I've had my 08 300 about 8 months now and had time to get to know the bike pretty well.
I love riding it and in this area I have almost nothing to complain about!

I ride some fairly nasty stuff so the bike gets a good workout on every ride.
I love the power, I did add a FWW which aided in traction thru the greasy roots that litter our local trails.
Did some minor changes to clean up the overly rich jetting .
Handling is awesome, light, nimble, tracks well and the ergos fit my 5' 9'' frame well.
Suspension was a little harsh front and rear, but I was able to sort that out with a re-valve, I like that the marz forks and sachs shock were easy to work on.
So far the bike proved to be very reliable, in the 8 months I had to very little to do but clean the air filter and change the trans oil.

So, what's there to complain about...mostly Fit and finish !

"Are you listening Gas Gas?"

Here's my don't likes:
1. notchy shifting:
It's not bad, just not as smooth as I'm used to (Honda/Yamaha)

2. squaky clutch:
That dose bug, it's not constant, mostly under a heavy load 2nd 3rd gear.

3. Brittle plastics:
They crack easily and don't hold up to impacts well

2. Gas tank shroud mounts:
Get rid of the cheap wood style screws that screw directly into the gas tank plastic, this is very Ala-Chinese cheapo style ...follow the top 5 manufactures mounting design.

3. Using nuts on the back side of so many mounting bolts:
What a complete "pain in the ass" to work on sometimes...take the sub-frame mounts...getting at the nuts of the upper mounts with a wrench is a hassle.
Would it be so hard to add a nut welded to the back side of the frame on some of these mount points??
I mean GG builds a bike that is so close to anything else on the market...but in my opinion...then drops the ball on areas that are very crucial to the consumer and probably not that much more in cost to add to the manufacturing process.
In any case I'd pay more for a bike that had better fit and finish.

4. head bolt sizes:
Ok, would it be so hard to use common sizes, 8mm, 10, 12, 14, 17, 19,
the bolts on my bike are a guess, I'm constantly running back and forth for wrenches...13mm, 15, 16, 18 etc... what the bloody hell.

5. Lower chain guide:
The lower tension-er style guide is too prone to damage, I think it's a weak point and don't see the advantage over a the style every other manufacture uses.

Conclusion:
So, in reality this is a very short list and not that big of a fix for the manufacture but is the difference between GG and a top Japanese bike.

Fit and finish is something that is very crucial to a owner and prospective buyer.
First thing I noticed when considering a GG was the cheap wood screw shroud mounts, as well as backing nut plates on just about every bolt.
So, I'm thinking what other shortcuts were taken?
Fortunately, everything else seems solid.
I wrote this because IMHO GG is so close but yet so far!

I say to GG take that last step ...add the missing fit and finish and climb to the top!

 

[noobi]

my 09 ktm 250exc uses screws to hold the shrouds onto the tank.

 

[gasgasnz]

gas tank shroud mounting is surposed to have changed for 2010 models?

 

[coolum74]

Buy a 4 Banger Honda so you can revalve it in 1000klm.

 

[moto9]

Buy a 4 Banger Honda so you can revalve it in 1000klm.

Been there done that,between 2004 and 07 I raced three 450's and one 250, actually only the 250 needed a valve job with 150 hours...if that's what your refering to.
Besides, I think your missing my point.
Just because Honda had some valve issues on their early F's does not negate what I stated in the thread...everything I said was valid.
I'm just saying GG could refine what is already a great bike...with just a little more design effort on their part and give it that fit and finish it's missing in some areas.

 

[Nick]

Have you had a problem with the chain guide ? or just dont like how it looks ? I've yet to have a problem with one.

 

[F_G]

I'm with ya' on the hardware thing. Holy crap, how many wrenches should you have to use? The mismatched hardware is almost embarrassing.

Other than that, pretty dang happy. Actually like the use of Nylocs to back up bolts, mush easier to change than a gnarled up captured fastener.

Try different tranmission oils, found one that improved shifting and quieted the clutch down.

Chain guide - non issue. I changed every stock one on every other bike I owned as they are all crap.

 

[skid jackson]

no issues with my chain guide either ..
agree with you on the multiple choice wrench/fastener set up!!
toss in the allen head bolts and you got a real smorgashborg of fasteners to deal with. most everything should be 8,10, or 12mm!!!

 

[REVERUP]

Yes I agree, the multiple hardware sizing is getting a little long in the teeth. Even if Gas Gas got rid of 1 or 2 sizes it would help. I do however think I like the nut on the back over a welded on or tapped part as its far easier to replace the nut if it strips out.

I'll take a squeaky clutch over one that wears out in a few hard events any day. The Gas Gas stocker is the most durable clutch I know of, and IMHO doesn't really seem to me to be any noisier than others unless really heated up in a survival style race, and at that point who cares, my mind and body are screaming too.

I think the stock plastics are pretty darn good. In all the years riding, racing Gas Gas Ive only had two replace two pieces due to breakage. Maybe I've been lucky.

I agree on the wood screws on the Gas tank there is a better way.

The stock chain guide works for some. I have bent one and ever since, that is one of the first things I change out.

I also wouldn't be disappointed if they decided to make the oil fill hole a bit larger, and went away from the black powder coat fad right now. Ya the moto style black rims, swing arm, forks etc...

Roscoe

 

[roostafish]

I'm with ya on the fasteners too, and the itty bitty oil fill hole. What's up with that anyway? Minor annoyances if you ask me, compared to the performance of the bike as a whole.

I have broken one chain guide, but as a whole I think it works fine. It has worked fine for Husqvarna for 30 years or more, and I've never heard a complaint from the Husky crowd.

 

[moto9]

I'm with ya' on the hardware thing. Holy crap, how many wrenches should you have to use? The mismatched hardware is almost embarrassing.

Other than that, pretty dang happy. Actually like the use of Nylocs to back up bolts, mush easier to change than a gnarled up captured fastener.

Try different tranmission oils, found one that improved shifting and quieted the clutch down.

Chain guide - non issue. I changed every stock one on every other bike I owned as they are all crap.

I can live with a nut on the back side of a few bolts as long as I can get at the nut, the upper subframe mounting nuts are a bugger to get a wrench on.
I'm using Belray trans oil 85W...what's the perfered stuff ?

 

[roostafish]

Preferred oil: Rotella 5w-40. or Amsoil 0w-40.

I can easily get a wrench on my upper subframe bolts. Just take the seat off, it only takes a second.

 

[F_G]

I'm using Belray trans oil 85W...what's the perfered stuff ?

I hate oil opinions and discussions. Don't laugh now, but I tried the Rotella, which BTW worked fabulously in my KTM, my GasGas didn't like it, didn't like Bel-Ray either, decided to try something I used to use years ago.........ATF, shifting improved and cut the clutch sqwalling considerably. And the stuff is cheap enough I change it every other ride, which to me is more important than what you use. Again, just my experience, not an endorsement.

 

[marshalls113]

All these are valid points. As someone who was trying to sell GG's for years, I wish they would listen. Pointing out that there are other bikes that have problems to, is not the point. Those other bikes are what people are used to, they are going to get a pass on many of their problems. GasGas has to be better, especially if it's not going to be cheaper. The European mentality of "we build a great motorcycle and everyone should buy it regardless" is the problem. Americans need justification for their purchases. I've even seen the bike get blamed for the lack of mechanical skill by the owner, where if it was a Honda he would have blamed himself for that broken bolt or the engine that blew because it never had a top end.

Dan

 

[moto9]

All these are valid points. As someone who was trying to sell GG's for years, I wish they would listen. Pointing out that there are other bikes that have problems to, is not the point. Those other bikes are what people are used to, they are going to get a pass on many of their problems. GasGas has to be better, especially if it's not going to be cheaper. The European mentality of "we build a great motorcycle and everyone should buy it regardless" is the problem. Americans need justification for their purchases. I've even seen the bike get blamed for the lack of mechanical skill by the owner, where if it was a Honda he would have blamed himself for that broken bolt or the engine that blew because it never had a top end.

Dan

Good point !

 

[coolum74]

All these are valid points. As someone who was trying to sell GG's for years, I wish they would listen. Pointing out that there are other bikes that have problems to, is not the point. Those other bikes are what people are used to, they are going to get a pass on many of their problems. GasGas has to be better, especially if it's not going to be cheaper. The European mentality of "we build a great motorcycle and everyone should buy it regardless" is the problem. Americans need justification for their purchases. I've even seen the bike get blamed for the lack of mechanical skill by the owner, where if it was a Honda he would have blamed himself for that broken bolt or the engine that blew because it never had a top end.

Dan

I may be wrong but aren't you double dipping there? So because Honda has a major valve issue that they ignore and they are a major manufacturer it can be overlooked (or are we expected to just get used to it). Makes the original post look pretty minor IMHO.

Yes the Gassers have faults but is it really any worse than any other manufacturere's?

Cheers

 

[moto9]

I may be wrong but aren't you double dipping there? So because Honda has a major valve issue that they ignore and they are a major manufacturer it can be overlooked (or are we expected to just get used to it). Makes the original post look pretty minor IMHO.

Yes the Gassers have faults but is it really any worse than any other manufacturere's?

Cheers

I don't think so on the dbbl dipping...Of course I had an issue about my 250's valves, as I did when my 85 yz 250 kept eating stators, and and my 88 cr 250 fouling plugs and bending linkage bolts.
After getting blasted on many a fourms honda improved their valves and valve seats.
Consumer products evolve when we the consumer brings to light what problems they had with the product, what they did and didn't like...what areas need improving.

I called out what I didn't like about my product, what I think (IMHO) needs improving...should we all just stick our heads in the sand and take what we get without a word and thank out lucky stars that at least we don't have valve issues.

"Yes the Gassers have faults but is it really any worse than any other manufacturere's?"
To answer your question no, but I'm not on another manufacturere's bike and if I were I'd give feed back on it/them as well
My thread is only constructive criticism directed at product improvement

 

[coolum74]

I"Yes the Gassers have faults but is it really any worse than any other manufacturere's?"
To answer your question no, but I'm not on another manufacturere's bike and if I were I'd give feed back on it/them as well
My thread is only constructive criticism directed at product improvement

Well said and touche'

 

[marshalls113]

I may be wrong but aren't you double dipping there? So because Honda has a major valve issue that they ignore and they are a major manufacturer it can be overlooked (or are we expected to just get used to it). Makes the original post look pretty minor IMHO.

Yes the Gassers have faults but is it really any worse than any other manufacturere's?

Cheers

I'm not saying what the public does is rational, actually it's wrong, but that's what happens. I think GG's are great bikes, but the poster has a point and what I'm saying is that GG can't hide behind the fact that other bikes have problems to. They have to be better or cheaper (both would be great) because they don't have a 40 yr reputation of building very good bikes, like the Japanese makes. They could also use a course in marketing. Marketing is why the public eats up KTM's not because they're better. KTM is a European company that figured out how to market in the US, but it takes money.

Dan

 

[roostafish]

I'm not saying what the public does is rational, actually it's wrong, but that's what happens. I think GG's are great bikes, but the poster has a point and what I'm saying is that GG can't hide behind the fact that other bikes have problems to. They have to be better or cheaper (both would be great) because they don't have a 40 yr reputation of building very good bikes, like the Japanese makes. They could also use a course in marketing. Marketing is why the public eats up KTM's not because they're better. KTM is a European company that figured out how to market in the US, but it takes money.

Dan

Brilliant point on the marketing. I think Gas Gas has tried to use some of that inertia from KTM by making a 300 and a 200. The problem is, there's very little money to get the word out. When they hired Paul Edmonson back in the '90s and he won world championships on the bike, that was huge for the European market, but the U.S. doesn't really buy into the world championship, they need a U.S. champion. Even still, you could provide some test mules for motorcycle magazines. It's money, money money. The importer can't afford to cut loose with free bikes to get hammered on, all to not gain sales. The reviews won't sell bikes unless they're consistently good, and plentiful. Somebody very enthusiastic about the brand (a Phil Knight, so to speak) would have to pony up for the cost of some bikes for testing, and make them "ringers." I'm not suggesting to cheat, but take care of a couple of the little PITA's and send them out, and send support, like the big boys do. Too bad our little club of enthusiasts is full of average dudes, and not a couple of multi millionaires.