Throttle response

[stabak]

Had a bike swap with my friend's beta 250 '13 and fell in love with the way the throttle felt. Light, crisp and quite aggressive. Some might say that it feels jerky or unusable on the trails but again I am wondering if I could get my GG 250 '15 to behave this way on the initial bite...

My setup is AS1 with a N3EW 175,38 that I prefer over a NEDW, even though the suzuki needle gives power I feel it is cutting on high rpm... no head job yet Still the action takes some time and throttle feels "heavy"... can't describe it better. Like the slide spring is heavier or smg.

Is it a matter of needle/jet thing, slide, throttle cable/twist/cam, squish/compression or just different overall engine characteristics? If a combination of things which makes the bigger difference?

Beta's response makes you ride sportier. This is not always my intention and do understand that GG power is more controllable specially in the higher rev band but again I would like to play sometimes.

 

[Jakobi]

Comparing my EC250R to my dealers 15 EC250 demo I know the difference you speak of. Both running same carb, same jetting.

I have head cut, G2 Ergo quick pull throttle, 50T rear sprocket vs 48T on his. Mine feels much more aggressive.

Have you done anything with the powervalve setup?

Edit. My 250R is a 13 model.

 

[Simmo737]

Comparing my EC250R to my dealers 15 EC250 demo I know the difference you speak of. Both running same carb, same jetting.

I have head cut, G2 Ergo quick pull throttle, 50T rear sprocket vs 48T on his. Mine feels much more aggressive.

Have you done anything with the powervalve setup?

Jakes onto it, on the 300 15 with the n3 needle you can dial it to meet the hit of the n3, so you even out the response, if you don't it feels doey, also check that the routing of the throttle cable is not too tight and binding and you have correct throttle freeplay. Mine is as responsive throttle wise as the 13 t the 13 is more aggressive right off the crack of the throttle ( I personally find that tiring)

 

[stabak]

Thanks for the responses guys, haven't messed with the power valve position yet but I doubt it will lighten that feeling of throttle response.

I might have work to do

 

[barossi73]

The ned? needles spread the hit for nice control,they feel doughey i think because when you want that strong mid range hit you really have to twist throttle fast and far.the noz and presumably n3 everything is available within 1/4 to 1/2turn apart from topend overrev.im guessing jakobi has that g2 quick pull to quicken the ned?
I like the less wristy noz?,but cant live with the abruptness in the sketchy stuff so am running nedh/nech for now.considering a leaner slide noz combo for next experimenting

 

[hamilton]

If your saying throttle control with engine off seems heavy, most bikes with some time on them often wear the handle bar and throttle tube. If your cable and slide spring are positioned correct and operate smooth most times bars and throttle tube need to be replaced to get that silky smooth new bike feel.

If your talking power wise my 15 seems a little lackluster off idle to 1/8 throttle. I'm working on finding a little gain myself.

 

[Jakobi]

Main reason I use the G2 Quick Pull is to decrease throttle rotation required for WOT. In both setups I use the 20% larger cam (requires clearancing of the throttle housing). I go this route as I personally find it very difficult to either maintain throttle control at small inputs with a large over grip (which is required to twist to wot), or to re-adjust my grip on the throttle to achieve wot (even more so at higher speeds/on the pipe).

You also get a throttle tube machined from 6061 compared to the OEM plastic tube which can break/deform and hang up and cause drag as Hamilton has said.

As an added feature, it does improve throttle response in that smaller inputs at the bar equates to larger movements at the slide. This does take a bit of finesse and some respect in terms of throttle input, but if you ride with the clutch playing as it should it's nothing overwhelming.

The GG also ships with a spare slide spring on the fuel line (between tank and carb). Not sure if one is heavier than the other.

Really depends if you mean response as in the engine responding, or the feel at the grip as to what will make it feel the way you please.

I rode a new Beta 300 and its engine response was very strong right off idle. Quite punchy and torquey. Been a while since I've rode a 300 though so hard to make any real comparisons.

 

[barossi73]

G2 make nice kit,the reduced twist would be nice with nedx.um,that spring though...i always thought that was for anti-kink fuelline,and a degree of protection/seperation from hot cases/boot rub etc...

 

[gasgasman]

Here's the G2 quick turn throttle.

http://www.g2ergo.com/store/2-stroke-quick-turn-system/

 

[barossi73]

Yip,some nice handguards(closed or billet open)to protect that g2 quickturn too!
On the wish list right behind that 6.5slide!(200).
Youv prob done all below but...
Dont rule out a dragging cable,oil that fly by wire system and clean out the pulley/spindle,a smidge of grease or few drops oil in the center.lift the tank a little and fiddle the cable into best pos,also plastic throttle tube cover shouldnt be screwed down too tight.also check barends if open for dirt jammed up the tube binding.could be worth removing tube and cleaning gunge inside and bar outer.maybe silicone spray?on the tube inner plastic?dont quote me,ive not tried it!
Apologies if you were only referring to the nedx when you described heavy feeling action.i may have misinterpreted post.
In theory the shorter travel of g2 quickturn should increase 'weight' of throttle spring (higher gearing),in reality id guess its offset by less friction,smoother operation gains plus a quicker action?

 

[stabak]

If your talking power wise my 15 seems a little lackluster off idle to 1/8 throttle. I'm working on finding a little gain myself.

about it plus an on/off sensation

The GG also ships with a spare slide spring on the fuel line (between tank and carb). Not sure if one is heavier than the other.

never thought of that

Ignore the description "heavy" cause it may lead to drag/oiling remedies... focus on crisp/sharp, MX-ish type of throttle response sensation.
My air screw is 1.75 turns out and have 50T on the back.

 

[stabak]

for what is worth, 3 turns out on the pv regulator made a lot of difference. Rev-ier engine, on the pipe earlier in throttle position and in general a sportier feeling, almost unridable in technical sections... think I'll go 2.5 turns next but feels nice to have that option...

 

[Jakobi]

Very nice to hear it's done something. I personally haven't heard any reports from anyone making adjustments on the 15+ adjustable PV. Maybe I should sneakily open up the demo bike when the dealers not looking

YEAH!

 

[stabak]

Over some rides in the summer, felt again like the bike didn't respond down low....

Went with 1.5 turns out the powervalve which is half turn "torquier" setting from standard 2 position. Smiles back again. Power low and linear transition almost like suzuki needles. Haven't tested top power with this position and at this point know how to get some (>=2.5 turns, pointy engine as per manual) but was pleased with the result.