Anyone have a spare JD Red?
- Thread starter Jakobi
- Start date
Simmo737
Gold Level Site Supporter
Yep, for the way/ where I ride the blue needle is better, you definitely feel a torque difference. Red in a 36 mm carb is more towards the zuk needles. I haven't tried the Yamaha or NO needles as I'm so happy with the blue. I'm a lugger in the tight and it's brilliant on hills as its hard to stall so you just keep opening the throttle at low revs and pulling in the clutch and it will walk up anything. Great for rutted red clay and loam hills.
I been noticing that my bike leans out on long climbs so I'm going to raise the float to 7 mm ( my bowl should be 6.5) if I can be that accurate, might change my jetting a bit.
I wont be home till Saturday so I'll post it next week, pm me some details. Cheers. I'll send that suspension book as well.
I been noticing that my bike leans out on long climbs so I'm going to raise the float to 7 mm ( my bowl should be 6.5) if I can be that accurate, might change my jetting a bit.
I wont be home till Saturday so I'll post it next week, pm me some details. Cheers. I'll send that suspension book as well.
Jakobi
Super Moderator
Fantastic! There's no rush on it so I'll shoot you a PM next week (or on my days off).
I have a NOZJ here that I haven't tried yet either. Been really happy with the N3CJ. Very smooth and torquey off the bottom with a wickid mid range punch and a top end that almost reaches the moon. Great fuel economy to kick.
I'll be very interested to see how they all stack up.
I have a NOZJ here that I haven't tried yet either. Been really happy with the N3CJ. Very smooth and torquey off the bottom with a wickid mid range punch and a top end that almost reaches the moon. Great fuel economy to kick.
I'll be very interested to see how they all stack up.
GMP
Active member
The red is supposed to be based on the N3Cx needle. Blue loosely based on a DDK (same straight dia. with additional tapers).
The JD Blue from the generic kit, or older GasGas kit, is absolutely perfect in my 250 with the older 38mm AS I carb. Red is way too lean. Its probably too much to ask for it to work as well in the newer carb, as they are supposed to prefer leaner jetting. I wonder if the JD needles are different in the newer GG kit, or does he just package a different range of jets with the same needles and change the part #? I got so spoiled with my '07, just tried each needle, settled on the Blue in the middle clip, and just rode since '07 with just pilot and air screw changes when cold. I don't think anyone has experimented with a JD kit in a newer 250 with a 38mm AS II.
The JD Blue from the generic kit, or older GasGas kit, is absolutely perfect in my 250 with the older 38mm AS I carb. Red is way too lean. Its probably too much to ask for it to work as well in the newer carb, as they are supposed to prefer leaner jetting. I wonder if the JD needles are different in the newer GG kit, or does he just package a different range of jets with the same needles and change the part #? I got so spoiled with my '07, just tried each needle, settled on the Blue in the middle clip, and just rode since '07 with just pilot and air screw changes when cold. I don't think anyone has experimented with a JD kit in a newer 250 with a 38mm AS II.
Jakobi
Super Moderator
Mmm I'm pretty sure someone would have run a JD kit in their 2011s. It just doesn't seem to be well documented on here. Thats somewhat the beauty of the JD. You spend so much on them that you find a clip pos that works best and keep it!
I ran the JD Red in my WR250F and found it to be stellar, which is why I'd like to try one in the Gasser. It very may well be too lean with the 250 top end though.
I'm not even sure where I want to start with the jetting on it. Probably rich. Maybe 48 N3CJ#3 178. Has anyone run the YZ250 JD needle/KTM JD needles in their GG's? Would be interesting to see the variances.
I ran the JD Red in my WR250F and found it to be stellar, which is why I'd like to try one in the Gasser. It very may well be too lean with the 250 top end though.
I'm not even sure where I want to start with the jetting on it. Probably rich. Maybe 48 N3CJ#3 178. Has anyone run the YZ250 JD needle/KTM JD needles in their GG's? Would be interesting to see the variances.
Jakobi
Super Moderator
Keen to see the reply. I think Neil just answered for us though! Still keen..
TBH I think the key in getting the jetting dialled in quickly and painlessly is in spending the time/money to set the head up correctly. With 2.6mm squish the bike is so sensitive and inconsistent. The closer you get to ideal the more stable it becomes and the easier it is to pick a needle, clip pos, and then stick with it.
You know this all too well though! If I ever buy another new 2T it'll be the first thing I do.
Jakobi
Super Moderator
What size pilot did you pair the Red up with? Temp & elevation?
GMP
Active member
Well thats encouraging that the JD Blue works good. No reply from JD yet but I'll bet the needles are the same. From my experience with multiple 250s, squish correction will not make a significant difference in jetting, I made no corrections to my original settings. Plus, 250s are just generally easier to jet.
Jakobi
Super Moderator
Hey Simmo
Could you post up the JD recommended settings for 20-35C 300-1000M high RH. Just as a base point.
What does lean lean lean to the fear of seizing feel like Glenn? I went lean enough once that the power fell really flat in the mid and their was some pinging present. I did the same trick you did and pulled over to swap it out.
Could you post up the JD recommended settings for 20-35C 300-1000M high RH. Just as a base point.
What does lean lean lean to the fear of seizing feel like Glenn? I went lean enough once that the power fell really flat in the mid and their was some pinging present. I did the same trick you did and pulled over to swap it out.
GMP
Active member
Flat power, hanging idle, some pinging, just a way different feel in a bad way than what the bike runs like normally. These bikes like to err on the rich side if anything for best torque.
The Red and Blue needles are very different structures, not just a clip length apart. The Red's straight section is like four sizes leaner! Its designed as a high altitude needle.
I have a Red I will likely not use. I'll trade you for a Blue if you can find one. Will save me the cost of a kit. A quick test: try a DDK in your 300, if its not close, don't bother with the JD Blue.
The Red and Blue needles are very different structures, not just a clip length apart. The Red's straight section is like four sizes leaner! Its designed as a high altitude needle.
I have a Red I will likely not use. I'll trade you for a Blue if you can find one. Will save me the cost of a kit. A quick test: try a DDK in your 300, if its not close, don't bother with the JD Blue.
Jakobi
Super Moderator
Just had a look at my cheat sheet I've made up.
OEM needle diameters
D=2.685mm
E=2.695mm (JD Blue)
F=2.705mm
G= 2.715
H= 2.725
W=2.735 (JD Red)
J= 2.745
I'm currently running a J in my 300 with a 42 pilot. I have tried F, G, H, and W/I as well. I have run a 42 and a H and agree it is more torquey but it also loads up, won't idle, blows alot of smoke and burbles alot more. As it becomes rich on the pilot the bike then gets very burble burble punch and becomes harder to modulate where the leaner setup feels crisper but smoother. 38 H is ok, 40 W is probably the best, 42 J is what I use cause I don't have an N3CW, but i do have an N3CJ.
Maybe if I like Simmo's red needle we can go halvies in a kit Glenn?
Pretty sure I tried the 42 and 40 pilot with the JD red, temps were around 45 - 65 F, elev around 300 - 1000 ft msl. The lean area was worst around 1/3 to 1/2 throttle, especially with steady throttle, and had a lean, "hollow" sound on decelleration...based on the diameter, I thought the Blue would be too rich, but my bike likes it.
