Differences

[12Bravo]

What are the differences besides price between:

GasGas EC300
Beta 300RR
KTM 300 EXC

I've looked around and other than brand loyalty, I'm not seeing a huge difference other than KTM suspension sucks, which is no big deal to me. I would have to have it re-valved and sprung anyways for my weight.

 

[Mick]

It is like asking the differences between Ford, Chevy, and Dodge.

All about the same, just do things a little differently.

Though I am looong time Toyota fan, so....


Right now it is more about needs/wants for me. KTM/Husky fills my need for a big after market gas tank for my long ass rides I like to do, neither GG or Beta do. If you want a no bullshit bike, the "new" and I use that word very loosely, the new YZ250X is probably the best deal out there right now. No e-start to fuss with, KYB suspension...long time proven engine. gas it up and go, people will generally ignore you at the trial head..a Yammie...boring...which is a good thing.

http://dirtbiketest.com/fresh-dirt/2016-yamaha-yz250x-first-riding-impression/

Going to buy the wife a new bike, it is either going to be a KTM 200 or a Beta X-Trainer.

Really like my GG 300, would love to get her a GG, but they are too damn heavy for her. Size is good though.

 

[memphis2857]

The x-trainer and the 200 are worlds different from each other. The x-trainer being a much better platform for a beginner or slower rider. I ride with a lady that has one and it fits her perfectly. Her husband rides a 200 and it's too tall and she doesn't like the hit that it has.

As far as the 250x if you haven't rode one it's hard to see what makes it different but I promise you it is nothing like a regular yz250. The engine characteristics are totally different and the suspension is perfect right out of the box. There are 2 of them in our riding group now and the guys just absolutely love them. My only complaint is the 2 gal. Gas tank but it sounds like you will be buying a tank no matter what you get. I suggest you try to find a place where you can try and ride one.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Mick]

The x-trainer and the 200 are worlds different from each other. The x-trainer being a much better platform for a beginner or slower rider. I ride with a lady that has one and it fits her perfectly. Her husband rides a 200 and it's too tall and she doesn't like the hit that it has.

I think the X-Trainer would be better...though same problem...even the aftermarket IMS tank is too small.

KTM can be lowered, and the engined d-tuned.

As far as the 250x if you haven't rode one it's hard to see what makes it different but I promise you it is nothing like a regular yz250. The engine characteristics are totally different and the suspension is perfect right out of the box. There are 2 of them in our riding group now and the guys just absolutely love them. My only complaint is the 2 gal. Gas tank but it sounds like you will be buying a tank no matter what you get. I suggest you try to find a place where you can try and ride one.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I have ridden a few aluminum framed YZ's with WR gearing, and some engine work. I guess what Yamaha is doing is what guys have been doing to YZ's for years.

Acerbis makes some decent sized tanks for the Yammies. 3.3 to 6 gallon.

 

[swazi_matt]

Get the xtrainer you will love it (and may from time to time let your wife ride it!)

 

[3beejay3]

What are the differences besides price between:

GasGas EC300
Beta 300RR
KTM 300 EXC

I've looked around and other than brand loyalty, I'm not seeing a huge difference other than KTM suspension sucks, which is no big deal to me. I would have to have it re-valved and sprung anyways for my weight.

The KTM and GG have more modern seating/ergos, where you sit on the bike. The Betas I rode recently you sit 'in' the bike a little bit, kinda like an older mid 0X Suzuki RM 250 or equivalent. Not worse, just different.
I prefer the ergos of the modern GGs as they fit me like a glove out of the box- I don't have to do a thing. Same with the new Shercos.
The Beta 2ts have an incredibly smooth power delivery, almost ridiculously so.
I've never cared for the stock power delivery on the KTM 2ts. Too much drama - like dealing with a vain, self absorbed teenaged girl.....

 

[Rod Overstreet]

I'm confused....You are a beginning rider, have a 200 and according to your own posts, still struggling with certain situations like mud / technical stuff. Now your looking at 300's, which will be even more difficult for a beginner to ride in those same situations?

No offense but this reminds me of my dealership days, and trying to educate the new riders I referred to as "parking lot pro's". I will explain. A new rider is easily sold on a 450 because of the power he felt while riding his buddies bike up and down the street there in the subdivision. He comes into the dealership, buys this beast of a bike, heads the woods then struggles all day on a machine he isn't ready for. Next thing you see is he has the bike for sale or trades to a SXS or a bass boat.

Yes, I agree that a 300 can sometimes be easier to ride than the 200 (especially in your part of the world) because the rider can get lazy, short shift the bike to stay out of the "hit" and just use the torque to get him up and over the tough stuff, but from what I've read in your posts, your still learning the basics of trail riding.

My advice...keep your 200 for now. Set it up to suit YOU then ride, ride and ride. Perhaps we can meet somewhere and do some riding together. You would be more than welcome to ride my bike, then decide on what you need to do. What is most important is for you to have fun and stay safe.

 

[Rod Overstreet]

I've never cared for the stock power delivery on the KTM 2ts. Too much drama - like dealing with a vain, self absorbed teenaged girl.....

Awesome. I needed a good laugh this morning!

 

[12Bravo]

I'm confused....You are a beginning rider, have a 200 and according to your own posts, still struggling with certain situations like mud / technical stuff. Now your looking at 300's, which will be even more difficult for a beginner to ride in those same situations?

No offense but this reminds me of my dealership days, and trying to educate the new riders I referred to as "parking lot pro's". I will explain. A new rider is easily sold on a 450 because of the power he felt while riding his buddies bike up and down the street there in the subdivision. He comes into the dealership, buys this beast of a bike, heads the woods then struggles all day on a machine he isn't ready for. Next thing you see is he has the bike for sale or trades to a SXS or a bass boat.

Yes, I agree that a 300 can sometimes be easier to ride than the 200 (especially in your part of the world) because the rider can get lazy, short shift the bike to stay out of the "hit" and just use the torque to get him up and over the tough stuff, but from what I've read in your posts, your still learning the basics of trail riding.

My advice...keep your 200 for now. Set it up to suit YOU then ride, ride and ride. Perhaps we can meet somewhere and do some riding together. You would be more than welcome to ride my bike, then decide on what you need to do. What is most important is for you to have fun and stay safe.

I complete agree, there is just one issue.

My bike is a 1999, I am not wanting to put $1000's of dollars into a 16 year old bike. I'm not wanting to buy a new bike "right" now either. I am a through researcher before I spend a large amount of money. Not to mention, I am LARGE, while I am still working on losing weight I am currently ringing the neck of the 200 to get up many of the hills we have locally. Which can't be good for it, thus making me worry about putting more money into a 16 year old bike. The only reason I purchased this bike was to see if I liked to ride dirt as much I liked to ride on the street. I do, I'm hooked for sure now.

While I understand the dealership days thinking, yes I am a beginner. I am not wanting to jump up faster than I think I can handle. I also understand the power of the right wrist. Great example, the other day I laid the bike down twice from loss of power while climbing a technical hill. I either had to clutch the crap out of the bike to get up or hit the hill/rocks to fast and be all over the place to make it up. With the 300, I would have more lower end torque and be able to stay in the sweet spot right before the hit and still make it through the area, call it lazy if you wish. I prefer to call is it safe and controlled.

While I am still looking at a newer bike, this thread is also about me engaging the community on here to see first hand knowledge of these bikes that I like. I am likely 6 months from doing anything, research research research!

 

[12Bravo]

Perhaps we can meet somewhere and do some riding together.

I would be interested in this. One thing I have learned while shooting Archery on the National stage, always train with people that are better than you! Makes training more focused.

One issue I am finding locally, no one wants to ride with new riders. The can't seem to just stop every 10-15 minutes to let me catch up, when I'm literally only 1-2 minutes behind them. Thus leaves me not riding when I can, because I don't feel comfortable riding alone.

I did however have one guy say "For someone that has only ridden a dirt bike 4 times, your light years ahead of many". So who knows.

 

[Rod Overstreet]

Sounds like you have a plan laid out. Good for you! And to your mention of having some extra weight right now, hey man....most of us do. Depending on your actual size, I can see where a Gas Gas 200 might be a little under powered in some situations there in the mountains of east TN

I know you didn't ask for a sermon, so I'll give you my personal feelings about the 300's.

You cannot go wrong with a Gas Gas 300, of any year. The power is smooth, predictable, and the handling is like nothing else I've ever ridden in my 40+ years of twisting a throttle. Engine reliability is unreal. But be careful when you test ride one, especially if you just got off an orange 300. Your first impressions will be "Man is this thing slow or what?" No...its not slow by any means. It simply has a trials torque feel (usable power) that can be very misleading. Put the bike in the woods before coming to any conclusions. The worst the conditions, the better this bike works.

My first Gas Gas experience? After leaving the orange company, I bought a new 2010 EC300 sight unseen because the dealer had to order it. Heck, I had never ridden a Gasser before but I had to see what I had been missing.

My first trip thru the gears....I stopped and actually looked at the stickers on the bike to make sure I had picked up a 300. It was NOTHING like the orange bike I had previously been racing. To be honest, I was very disappointed at the lack of hit, but still loaded the bike up and headed to a local hare scramble the next day. After one lap, my "buyers remorse" turned into complete excitement about the bike and how well it worked in its element. Not only was I pumped, but so was a good friend at the time, who rode my bike, then made some drastic changes in his life path afterwards. (Nuff said)

Long story short....my passion for this brand doesn't come because it's my job. It's because I feel it's THE best all round off-road 2 stroke out there PERIOD. Is it perfect? No, but none of them are. The 300 Gasser has a little buzz in the bars that takes some time to get used to. (why on earth did the factory stopped using a head stay is beyond me) and feels porkier to me than the 250 for some reason. Another slight aggravation with the new frames (2012 and newer) is not having a large capacity fuel tank available. Most average skill riders don't have an issue with the stocker, but for the A class racer or the long distance trail rider, we need a larger tank.

That's about it on the 300 IMO but...for me...if I had to pick between the 300 and the 250??? I'll take the 250. I have simply fallen in love with it this year. I feel MUCH faster on it than the 300, and allot less tired at the end of the day.

Beta...I have no comment because I've never ridden one, but I have several friends that are have taken the plunge, and they remark how similar it is to the Gasser in terms of power. The GG handles better they say, but the Beta steers sharper. I have no doubts it would be a good choice as well.

Sorry to drag on and on. Let me know if you want to get together and ride. I'm not that far from you. Perhaps we could get together with Ken (Gasser) for a ride somewhere.

 

[Mick]

I complete agree, there is just one issue.

My bike is a 1999, I am not wanting to put $1000's of dollars into a 16 year old bike.

Trying to learn on a clapped out bike isn't the best thing either. Bud of mine was long time street rider, then moved to dirt, which has a very steep learning curve... bought a very old KTM 300...which was pretty much worn out when he got...he did "ok" with it, but struggled...then went out and bought a brand new 300...difference was and night and day. The new bike just simply worked, instead of trying to deal with the quirkyness of clapped out bike and trying to learn how to ride.

I would set a budget and try and find the best used bike you can. I wouldn't put any money into that '99...looks like a money pit, imo. When you get good you can become a brand whore and then you can pick up on the little differences.

I have owned darn near all the major brands...really, they are basically the same just slightly different here and there. My GG gas been my favorite...it isn't perfect though, and neither are we, we are human afterall.

 

[Chaz955i]

I complete agree, there is just one issue.

My bike is a 1999, I am not wanting to put $1000's of dollars into a 16 year old bike. I'm not wanting to buy a new bike "right" now either. I am a through researcher before I spend a large amount of money. Not to mention, I am LARGE, while I am still working on losing weight I am currently ringing the neck of the 200 to get up many of the hills we have locally. Which can't be good for it, thus making me worry about putting more money into a 16 year old bike. The only reason I purchased this bike was to see if I liked to ride dirt as much I liked to ride on the street. I do, I'm hooked for sure now.

While I understand the dealership days thinking, yes I am a beginner. I am not wanting to jump up faster than I think I can handle. I also understand the power of the right wrist. Great example, the other day I laid the bike down twice from loss of power while climbing a technical hill. I either had to clutch the crap out of the bike to get up or hit the hill/rocks to fast and be all over the place to make it up. With the 300, I would have more lower end torque and be able to stay in the sweet spot right before the hit and still make it through the area, call it lazy if you wish. I prefer to call is it safe and controlled.

While I am still looking at a newer bike, this thread is also about me engaging the community on here to see first hand knowledge of these bikes that I like. I am likely 6 months from doing anything, research research research!

Regarding the three bikes you've listed it is going to be tough to find a person that has ridden all three and will give a totally objective answer, especially when asking about a competing brand. My suggestion is go to the respective forums for each and look up the threads concerning problems and reliability issues. Should give a good indication of which bike would be easiest to live with. None of those bikes would hold you or most of us back in stock form.

Good luck on your search.

 

[Rod Overstreet]

I would be interested in this. One thing I have learned while shooting Archery on the National stage, always train with people that are better than you! Makes training more focused.

One issue I am finding locally, no one wants to ride with new riders. The can't seem to just stop every 10-15 minutes to let me catch up, when I'm literally only 1-2 minutes behind them. Thus leaves me not riding when I can, because I don't feel comfortable riding alone.

I did however have one guy say "For someone that has only ridden a dirt bike 4 times, your light years ahead of many". So who knows.

Dude...I'm now a fat and slow old man. You may have to wait on me! I know what you have been against. In my years, I've always noticed those "fast guys" that turn a trail ride into a race....never show up to a real race. For me, race day means just that, but on a trail ride, it is the responsibility of the faster riders to find a pace that suits everyone in the group. You never run off and leave the slower guy, and you always stop and wait for everyone in the group at every fork of the trail.

 

[Mick]

Dude...I'm now a fat and slow old man. You may have to wait on me! I know what you have been against. In my years, I've always noticed those "fast guys" that turn a trail ride into a race....never show up to a real race. For me, race day means just that, but on a trail ride, it is the responsibility of the faster riders to find a pace that suits everyone in the group. You never run off and leave the slower guy, and you always stop and wait for everyone in the group at every fork of the trail.

^this^

It is hard to find guys that don't want to race on the trail ride. I just like getting out and exploring anymore. My racing days are behind me. End up going by myself mostly...since I just want to do my own thing...(you guys can spare me the "yes mom, I know riding by myslf is bad" )

When we do group trail rides, we like to have a guy ride sweep...just incase the slower rider needs help. Believe it is good for the newer rider's morale if someone is there to lend a hand, or just some say some words of encouragement.

Here I am behind the camera riding sweep on one of our Taylor Park trips.

 

[Rod Overstreet]

^this^

It is hard to find guys that don't want to race on the trail ride. I just like getting out and exploring anymore. My racing days are behind me. End up going by myself mostly...since I just want to do my own thing...(you guys can spare me the "yes mom, I know riding by myslf is bad" )

When we do group trail rides, we like to have a guy ride sweep...just incase the slower rider needs help. Believe it is good for the newer rider's morale if someone is there to lend a hand, or just some say some words of encouragement.

Here I am behind the camera riding sweep on one of our Taylor Park trips.

NiCE picture!!! Looks like fun Mick!

 

[Mick]

NiCE picture!!! Looks like fun Mick!

Thanks Rod. Taylor Park is a hoot!

Can't remember the name of that trail...it got a lot harder towards the top. Slick roots and rocks, even gave the good riders some problems. I know some beginner riders get discourage, I always tell them, hey there is always someone better than you and always someone worse. At least you're out here and not on the couch.

 

[Rod Overstreet]

Thanks Rod. Taylor Park is a hoot!

Can't remember the name of that trail...it got a lot harder towards the top. Slick roots and rocks, even gave the good riders some problems. I know some beginner riders get discourage, I always tell them, hey there is always someone better than you and always someone worse. At least you're out here and not on the couch.

You just stepped allover my feet...as I here I sit on the couch myself! Hopefully when GG gets their self together, we can get back on the road and perhaps travel your way for a trail ride. I'll make sure you get a nice shiny sticker for your hauler window

 

[Mick]

You just stepped allover my feet...as I here I sit on the couch myself! Hopefully when GG gets their self together, we can get back on the road and perhaps travel your way for a trail ride. I'll make sure you get a nice shiny sticker for your hauler window

ha ha...I did post that from a recliner!

I just happened to be in AZ for a wedding, I thought I was going to be riding today in our charity DS ride that we started a couple years ago, but my buddy gave me the wrong dates....it is next weekend. dang it!

I am hoping all the best for GG. Oh, yeah if you're ever though this part of the country...I'll show you around. Only moved to Idaho a year ago, so I am still learning the area. Some of the best riding I have ever done...darn near endless trails here.

Dirt biking is fairly popular here, GG's are fairly rare though...I get a lot of looky-loos at mine, not many have seen them in person.

Perhaps GG will have something next year to show at the races. The Idaho City 100 draws quite the crowd, and we have a National Hare & Hound in Murphy.

 

[Jakobi]

What are the differences besides price between:

GasGas EC300
Beta 300RR
KTM 300 EXC

I've looked around and other than brand loyalty, I'm not seeing a huge difference other than KTM suspension sucks, which is no big deal to me. I would have to have it re-valved and sprung anyways for my weight.

I've owned 2 x Gas Gas chassis and several engine configurations from 300 to worked 250s. My preference also falls in line with the less is more train of thought. I won't elaborate too much on why, but essentially it just suits my riding style better allowing me to ride harder/longer/faster with less effort.

I've setup multiple Ktms for friends, and there are so many around that it's easy to find an opportunity to throw a leg over. Big refinements in chassis, suspension, and also engine on these machines. You could ask a thread about what's the difference in 300excs from year to year. Earlier models handle like crap and are more aggressive in nature. 14+ have a different head and better geometry. Anything from around 10-13 could be tuned into a decent machine. Engine is very versatile and can be a sassy girl or a big pussy depending (but then again most 2 strokes can easily be tuned with a little knowledge).

Beta range I have not seen in the flesh. I have a mate who should be taking ownership of a new 300rr in the next several weeks. Without a doubt I'll be looking over it. More than likely will be involved in refining the setup and getting a few opportunities to test ride and make some comparisons.

You've also left a couple other options off your list if you are strictly considering 300's.

Imo, a 250F is probably one of the easiest bikes to ride due to their smooth linear power delivery. They will rev to the moon and go as fast as you can ride them without the bike being the limiting factor. Avoid buying an 'old' one though as it can be ticking time bomb scenario. Any used bike should be investigated pretty thoroughly regardless.

On another note, while this isn't the most expensive hobby/addiction/sport around, it also costs money and is hard to be done 'on the cheap'. You can stretch maintenance intervals, you can wear gear a bit past when its time to replace, but the more you ride, the more it costs. I'm in a different country with different prices for everything (but that is mostly relative too) and after crunching all the numbers the average cost to me to ride has worked out to about a dollar a km ($1/km) excluding purchase price of the bike itself. That figure covers fuel, fluids, periodic maintenance, ongoing replacement of gear, occassional damages/failure. If you only ride 50km a month it is pretty cheap, but if you start riding twice a week for 70-100km loops it becomes quite costly.