GasGas EC 300 Racing - Spluttering

[GasGasHungary]

Hello

I wonder if anyone can help me? I have just purchased a new GasGas EC 300 Racing and right out of the box it has a very bad splutter when accelerating. When accelerating (With the Mapping Switch in either position) in all gears, the initial acceleration is OK (for a second of so) and then it starts to splutter and the only way to go faster is to change up a gear, but it all jerky and hit and miss. There is a lot of smoke coming out of the exhaust and the back end of the bike is covered in oil from the exhaust. My guess is that its running too rich. No jets or Carb settings have been touched ie. Its all at factory settings. Further information is, its Winter here and is between 0 and 10 Deg C, plus we are at 100m above sea level, so all is fairly normal.... Is it normal to receive a GasGas in such a state and, does anyone agree that its running too rich, if yes to the latter, What are likely to be the main causes? Thanks.

 

[GasTimppa]

Hello

I wonder if anyone can help me? I have just purchased a new GasGas EC 300 Racing and right out of the box it has a very bad splutter when accelerating. When accelerating (With the Mapping Switch in either position) in all gears, the initial acceleration is OK (for a second of so) and then it starts to splutter and the only way to go faster is to change up a gear, but it all jerky and hit and miss. There is a lot of smoke coming out of the exhaust and the back end of the bike is covered in oil from the exhaust. My guess is that its running too rich. No jets or Carb settings have been touched ie. Its all at factory settings. Further information is, its Winter here and is between 0 and 10 Deg C, plus we are at 100m above sea level, so all is fairly normal.... Is it normal to receive a GasGas in such a state and, does anyone agree that its running too rich, if yes to the latter, What are likely to be the main causes? Thanks.

If you have N1EF needle in your carb I'll suggest to try 40/ 178 (-180) jetting. We have simillar weather and about same altitude. Needle in 2"st from top.

 

[Jakobi]

And make sure the float height is set correctly.

http://www.gasgasrider.org/forum/showthread.php?t=11886

Then start working on the jetting. Once you establish what our baseline is we'll be able to help you dial it in.

 

[SGM]

Float level set, a ktm n3eg needle @3, 40 / 178

 

[GasGasHungary]

All

Thank you for your responses and assistance. On Friday I will strip out the Carb and check against your feedback.

Sorry for the questions, but could you please explain

1. If you have N1EF needle in your carb - How can I tell?
2. 40/ 178 (-180) jetting - What does this mean?
3. Needle in 2"st from top - This means 2nd position from the top?

Thank you.

 

[Jakobi]

The needle will have a code stamped on it up the top near the clip grooves. The stock needle is N1EF. Clip positions are counted from the blunt end towards the pointy end.

The 40/178 is referring to pilot and main jets, respectively.

Do some reading on general jetting theory, youtube etc, and get a feel for how a carb comes together and apart. You'll have to pull it down in order to check all the jets and clip positions.

 

[husley]

Hmm

New bike debris in the pilot jet?

I have had two new bikes who's floats would stick in random locations until they broke/wore in

 

[GasTimppa]

One possibility is debris under choke piston.

 

[GMP]

ALWAYS flush a new tank clean and install a fuel filter before use, as there will almost always be some plastic shards present from the molding/mfg. process. Yes there are filters in the tank but they seem to come off the pick up tube (mine was bouncing around in the tank).

 

[GasGasHungary]

Dear All

Thank you for all of your sound advice, help and explanations. This weekend I will take a look at the Carb and will report all back to you. Thank you again.

 

[GasGasHungary]

Dear All

Apologies for my delayed response to you all, had a few non bike related issues to deal with that took quite some time.

Anyway - We ended up with the following:

- Jetting: 40/175.
- Needle: 3rd from top.

There is still a slight sputter but is much, much better - Thank you for all of your help.

Kind Regards

 

[GasGasHungary]

Dear All

Apologies for the delayed response....

I have ended up as:

40/ 175 jetting.
Needle in 3"st from top.

Although there is still a slight splutter.

Regards

 

[Jakobi]

Glad you found an improvement. Did you keep working with the stock needle?

 

[Gibby]

New XC 300R

Just picked up a new XC 300R from Mort's Powersports in Mobile, Alabama.
John the owner is a great guy and has been very helpful trying to help me get the bike dialed in, I have had the bike for 2 months and have put 10 hours on it. I will be riding mainly South Alabama Woods, Tight, Technical, Roots, Sandy, Hills and mud. I am 40 years Young, I have only been back riding for 1 year after a 7 year break, I raced in SERA Southern Enduro Riders,
in my late 20s early 30s. before that I rode alot but not raced.
I am 6ft 200 lb
South Alabama: Hot, Humid, Sea Level.
So far:
Main Jet: 172
Pilot Jet: 40
Airscrew: 1.5
Needle stock in the top clip,
Slide; stock
Fuel: 93 octane 100% unleaded, (no corn) 44to1 Golden Spectro.
Took a minute to get it lean enough. Seems to have good crisp power all the way through the power curve, rain setting. Still has alittle spooge but atleast I know there is lube.
Suspension seemed very ridgid at first, bounced in the rear over roots and square edges, divey in the front end going into corners.
Changed back tire to Michilin sc12wc (much better than stock)
backed off rear spring preload 2 turns, low speed compression 16 out,
rebound 20 out,
Front Forks: recieved with pfp all the way out. I Turned in 1.25 turns,
Compression 16 clicks out, Rebound 14 clicks out.
Seems alot better than stock but i like it soft and plush. I will call Evan at
Solid Performance, when i am ready for service and revalve, Hopefully he can help me plushin it up.
Allso moved bars to forward position. Cut 3/4 inch off both end of bars and added Cycra bark busters, Mounted light switch inside front number plate.
Love the 300 POWER, I can leave it in 3rd and work the clutch.
Bike Really promotes standing.
Any hints or tips would be greatly appreciated.
Josh Gibson
joshgibson@aencservices.com

13 XC300R (LUV IT)
02 DRZ 400 S, Great bike to get to work.
97 KTM 250 SX Awesome Machine But Needs LUV.
09 YZ450 Going to set up for woods.
99 KTM 300 MXC SOLD
97 KTM 250 EXC SOLD
92 KTM 250 EXC SOLD
LOTS OF OTHERS
FIRST BIKE 79 KX 80

 

[Jakobi]

Saw your post in the jetting DB. Didn't want to comment in there though as it fill the thread with woffle instead of serving its purpose though.

You'll find some decent improvements in power and fuel economy by binning that stock N1EF needle. Its the cause of the spooge and its all in the very early throttle openings. I see you've had to put it all the way to top clip to clean it up. This tends to leave it a touch lean in the mid.

 

[Gibby]

I have been reading about different needles but not sure what to try first.
If I move the clip down 1 it seems to have a splatter between mid and high after running it low for a while. Fouls a plug after every 2nd ride, rain or sun mode. if I leave it in the 2nd clip down. If I run it in top clip seems crisp. What does binning the needle mean? Any help would be appreciated my dealer is new and learning also.
How will I know if I am running lean in the mid range?

 

[Jakobi]

Binning - throwing it in the bin (where it belongs).

If its running lean in the middle it'll just lack torque and feel a bit flat under full load (uphill or sand). Heres a little something I sent in a PM to Clay the other day.

"Basically I have been working with 2 x OEM needles (Yamaha and Suzuki). They are both different and as such give different performance characteristics. All of my experience has been on an AS2 38mm, and its noted that the AS2 36mm jets differently, as does the AS1 38mm so that needs to be taken into consideration. Below is my 'specs' for an AS2 38mm.

Suzuki - NEDx/NECx - 3 tapers - Lean/Rich/Richer - Makes for a clean bottom end. Quite crisp and smooth, responds well to clutching. The richness through the mid smooths the hit and the revs continue into the upper RPM. The rich 3rd taper supplies fuel all the way towards WOT so a smaller main can be used for some decent overrev.

Yamaha - N3Ex/N3Cx - 2 tapers - Rich/Lean - Produces a torquier bottom end. Can be setup to still be crisp but have to be careful not to lift the clip too far or you lose the torque. Into the midrange the fuelling leans out a bit and the transition into the 2nd taper is hard and fast (snappy hit) and then it pulls and pulls in the top end. You need a decent sized main to keep the fuel supply up (about 2 larger than stock or Suzuki).

The needle diameter is a personal thing and can vary depending on fuels, altitiude, temps, preference/feel, as is the clip position and main as well I guess. My starting points would be.

EC250 (~0-900M/20-30C/50%RH)
40 N3CW#3 178
40 NEDW#2 172

EC300 (~0-900M/20-30C/50%RH)
42 N3CJ#3 178
42 NEDJ#2 172

Thats the starting point. Obviously still up to the tuner to work through the circuits and determine which pilot gives best response off the bottom, which needle clip pos runs best, and then finally the main. Feel free to post it in a thread and have it stickied if you like."

 

[Gibby]

I guess your right stock needle needs to be trashed.
Sounds like maybe I should try a nedj to start. what year is your 300 and what
Ratio are you running your fuel?
Thanks a lot very helpfull.

 

[Jakobi]

Probably best if you get some info from fellow americans who are running similar. I read a review on a 2013 the other day which was posted on here and think they ran 40 NEDJ#2 172. Dirtrider? I'm in Australia so slightly different fuels etc.

Mine is a 2010 model and I've run both the NEDx/NECx and N3Ex/N3Cx in various diameters with various configs across both 300 top ends and 250 top ends. The carb model seems to be the biggest variable across bike models.