Rekluse Core EXP

[hasslbri]

Rekluse finally finished the EXP clutches for the Gas Gas bike. I picked mine up from Gofasters on Monday. I installed it on Tuesday and rode that night.

I had the Z-start on my 06 300 and liked it. I took it off before the Six Days in Chile. I didn't want any chance of having to adjust it mid race or any possible failures with all the parts even though I had used it trouble free for 1 1/2 seasons. Since then I have gotten into trials bikes and started to use the clutch to conquer more and more obsticles. I really havn't been too interested in using an auto clutch until Rekluse came out with the EXP. It looked simple to install, easy to adjust, and it supposedly retained FULL lever feel. I pushed on Mark w/ Gofasters pretty hard to have Rekluse build one for gas gas.

When the clutches came in the boxes were quite large compared to the Z-start. You open the box and there are alot of parts and two manuals. I thought, what the hell did I get myself into....

After reading through the instructions I began the install. Basically, you remove your entire clutch including the stock basket. You install the new basket, spacers, inner pressure basket, rekluse metal plates, stock frictions, lining plate, rekluse pressure plate, and springs. Once the springs are tight, you adjust the gap using the dial-a-gap. Finally I put the cover on an did a break-in ride.

The first thing that amazed me was the lever feel. It might have been sligthly easier pull to it, but the feel is virtually identical to a regular clutch. Dinamite the brakes without pulling in the clutch and there was no stalling!!!

I rode back to the shop, let it cool and checked the gap. I managed to get 2 laps in on my 2 mile course that consists of lots of tight, technical off chamber, with rocks and log crossings. Unfortunitly it had rained so much I could not really push it to the limit but with the limited ride I was impressed. It felt as though I was running the stock clutch only there was no possibility of stalling. I could ride the bike however I wanted, with or without the lever. The engagment point seemed good with it engaging right off of idle. The only thing that was somewhat annoying was the chirp that I got from extremely low engagement. It is alittle more than normal. (I can get a stock clutch to chirp pretty good when I run it at super lower R's) I have my first race on it this weekend in Wisconsin. It is a very rocky place and there is a good chance it will be a mud race.

If anybody has any questions let me know. One thing I noticed with the installion is the instructions are for all motorcycles and there are a couple of Gas Gas specific parts that are included (thinner steel plate, thrust bearing, and washer.) Take your time and the install is super easy. Adjusting it is even easier. (No feeler guages!!!!)

Brian

 

[Skidad]

Ok this is great news, thanks. I have been waiting for this info on the new EXP for awhile (right Mark!).

Sounds like this weekends race will be a good test. Look forward to a more detailed review next Monday morning .

What bike did you install it on?

How did you find the engagement? Would it slip like a Pro or Z-start or was it kind of on/off abrupt?

There are different wedges available (light and heavy). Do you know what it has inside the pressure plate stock? Does it come with the different wedges? Comes with a new clutch cover also?

Pics, we need pics of the parts and install. This thing is huge money so I'm sure many would like to see as much as possible of everything involved before laying down the coin for it.

 

[hasslbri]

It is in my 09 300. The engagement is a touch harder than the z-start but not wheel spinning hard. I it better as you were never truely sure if the z-start was slipping too much or not. This is alttile more on and off (better for someone that wants complete feel of what the rear tire is doing.) I might be looking at a new 300, so if I transfer it to another bike I will do a step by step (photos) install. When you consider what is new in the kit, it really isn't that costly. You have a completely different basket, inner hub, metal plates, springs, pressure plate, outer ring, and billet anodized clutch cover. There is way more engineering that went into this than the z-start, yet there seems to me to be much less to fail. I bet you would spend that much just to replace the entire stock clutch and cover.

 

[aflica]

hasslbri

What about for the average guy that likes to ride tight and steep single track and just wants to have anti stall for when he's in the wrong gear at the wrong place and dosent want the fire to go out. Is this the clutch for him ? I ride tight , rooty , rocky trails , not much high speed , mostly 1st and 2nd , some 3rd when it turns into quad stuff , but mostly tight twisty single track. I just love using my clutch , but every once in a while i screw up and get caught in the wrong gear with no commitment and end up stalling in a bad place. Does it do the slipper thing and not stall ? And you can still use your clutch entirely like normal , like slipping it and shifting with it and starting off with it ? And did you have to space your brake pedal away for the new cover ? I'm thinking of this for the Namby , before i get too many hours on the clutch (BTW i agree with your findings on the TTX suspension , i love it )
Thanks with any answers here

 

[hasslbri]

It is excatly what your looking for. It for me is merely a stall preventer (I rarely stall my 300). I love to use my clutch and that is why I never went back to the z-start. The only real issue I can see that is a slight disadvantage is the fact that you cannot bump start the bike. Where I live the hills are ussually not big enough to bump a 300 anyway.

 

[Skidad]

Does it soften up the 300 any making it easier to ride?

 

[HuskyDude]

It is exactly what your looking for. It for me is merely a stall prevent-er (I rarely stall my 300). I love to use my clutch and that is why I never went back to the z-start. The only real issue I can see that is a slight disadvantage is the fact that you cannot bump start the bike. Where I live the hills are usually not big enough to bump a 300 anyway.

This does seem the answer to all. I really like what I'm hearing.

Two other question please hasslbri... If you're on a uphill and you stall, there is no engine break right? It would be like being in neutral. And how about engine breaking going dwn hill? Can you start the bike in gear?....(OK three question)

 

[hasslbri]

Yes, you stall it on a hill and you will roll backwards. I raced it at a rocky wisconsin race this last weekend and it worked flawlessly. As I stated before, it engages just off idle. So there was no ackward on-off feeling in the corners or free wheeling on the long downhills. The race was about as bad as they get without being muddy. I probably only got to 4th gear maybe twice all race. It was all snotty granite rocks. I had now engagement issues, fading, or any other issues besides the low speed squak when I would feather the clutch. I am sold on it so far. If it proves to be as trouble free as the Z-start it will be on all of my big bikes from now on.

Brian

 

[aflica]

The only real issue I can see that is a slight disadvantage is the fact that you cannot bump start the bike. Where I live the hills are ussually not big enough to bump a 300 anyway.

Man , where i live the hills are big enough to bump start a D9 Cat , but i rarely do a bump start , i dont like the feeling i get when i do it . Seems to me to be too hard on the clutch , and im not racing , so the only time i do that is when i have to to avoid whatever the alternative to not doing it would be , like getting run over from behind by your buddy on his KTM as that is the only way he's getting by your Gasser

 

[MikeID]

The Core EXP clutch works great on EC 300. It seemed to me clutch pull was heavier than stock, but not objectionable. The power was smooth, but you could still get great acceleration out of the bike.

The folks at Rekluse did some checkups on it and there were no issues. They were really impressed with the quality of the OEM fiber plates. One critical factor is the idle and also that the clutch lever adjustment so the plunger not be pushed in.

I wrote up a little review on the bike that is in this month's issue of Trials and Enduro News...it's actually on the cover.

http://www.tandenews.com

Mike

 

[Skidad]

The Core EXP clutch works great on EC 300. It seemed to me clutch pull was heavier than stock, but not objectionable. The power was smooth, but you could still get great acceleration out of the bike.

The folks at Rekluse did some checkups on it and there were no issues. They were really impressed with the quality of the OEM fiber plates. One critical factor is the idle and also that the clutch lever adjustment so the plunger not be pushed in.

I wrote up a little review on the bike that is in this month's issue of Trials and Enduro News...it's actually on the cover.

http://www.tandenews.com

Mike

Would it be possible to post that review of the bike with the EXP here on the GG forum? I think plenty of guys have interest in the EXP but would like to see more reviews before spending the big money.

 

[GSP]

Revloc Dyna ring

Hi Guys, just received my revloc dyna ring for my 07 EC 200 will install later this week and give a report. Not quite the same as the rekluse but should be interesting all the same.

 

[MikeID]

I'll ask Shan...if you haven't checked out the paper it's very well done. There's great coverage of National and Regional Enduros, Trials events, plus rider interviews, product and bike profiles and reviews.

I'll echo what the first poster said about it...the design is clean. It goes together very well in the clutch itself. I read the instructions about installation of the clutch and pulled it part to see how it fit together. There is a bit more mass to the clutch than the stock hub as you'd expect, but I found the feel of the clutch only got slightly heavier--but it was still lighter than other hydraulic clutch bikes I've ridden. Putting in new mineral oil also helped keep the clutch feel light. And like he found, checking the measurements is a quick job nowadays...take a quick look, then you are ready to ride.

The acid test is how does it work...and it works great. It took me some time to get comfortable with the freewheel effect with the throttle off, but once I acclimated to it, it became second nature. I still like to use the clutch, so for corners it's fun to get the extra boost. What the Rekluse clutch buys you is the virtual impossiblity of a stall, and you get great traction to boot. Stalling goes out the window as a consideration. On steep trails, sandy, with loose rock or little ledges, off-camber corners, the Rekluse clutch allows you to focus on forward progress.

I purposefully stopped on steep hills of various types to see how the bike would start out in recovery situations, and the auto clutch allows you to get going again with less effort than the working the clutch to try to find traction.

If you've got other questions, you can PM me or call me at 208-890-1557 during the day. If it's a question to which I don't know the answer, we can talk to the folks at Rekluse.

Mike

 

[ducrider]

Hi Guys, just received my revloc dyna ring for my 07 EC 200 will install later this week and give a report. Not quite the same as the rekluse but should be interesting all the same.

Do you have a part number for the dyna ring for the GG? And where did you buy it as I have unsuccessful in finding it. Thanks.

 

[Jim Cook]

Do you have a part number for the dyna ring for the GG? And where did you buy it as I have unsuccessful in finding it. Thanks.

Just curious, and not trying to be a smartA... But, have you tried calling RevLoc about the dyna ring? I've found that it is often more productive to call a supplier or manufacturer and ask specific questions, than it is to just surf their web site or ask around the web.

Jim

 

[ducrider]

Just curious, and not trying to be a smartA... But, have you tried calling RevLoc about the dyna ring? I've found that it is often more productive to call a supplier or manufacturer and ask specific questions, than it is to just surf their web site or ask around the web.

Jim

Hello Jim; you are not being a smartA as contacting Revloc was the first thing I tried to do. I left messages and an email. Weeks later, I am still waiting for a response. This is why I am seeking help from the inmates here. I have been told the GasGas uses the clutch plates from the CR Honda of the late 90's so I am assuming it is the Honda model; but you know what happens when you assume. I have used the Rekluse Pro in 2 KTMs, but am looking for a less expensive route to try with the GG than buying the Core EXP.

 

[Jim Cook]

Hello Jim; you are not being a smartA as contacting Revloc was the first thing I tried to do. I left messages and an email. Weeks later, I am still waiting for a response. This is why I am seeking help from the inmates here. I have been told the GasGas uses the clutch plates from the CR Honda of the late 90's so I am assuming it is the Honda model; but you know what happens when you assume. I have used the Rekluse Pro in 2 KTMs, but am looking for a less expensive route to try with the GG than buying the Core EXP.

Thanks man. I'm glad that what I said wasn't taken wrong.
To explain my statement a bit... When we had the shop, I had contact with some riders who were so "internet savy" that it seemed they had almost forgotten how easy it was to just call someone for info, and were basing their decisions entirely on what they read and second hand info from others. Some were actually hesitant to make an order that they could not make through an online shopping cart. With GasGas parts, I wouldn't set up a shopping cart because it was so easy for someone to order the incorrect part, and also that a shopping cart would not be able to give them all the options available for what they were trying to achieve. I felt that I could give then much better customer service over the phone.

Now, I haven't spoken with Revloc recently, so I did not realize that they were now that hard to contact.
I spoke with them at the Indy Dealer Expo, and also on the phone, several years ago when their product was only a couple of years old. At that time, they told me that they were not too interested in GasGas applications; so I sort of "farted them off".
I did, however, ride several KTMs of friends who had the Revloc installed, and with them discussed some of the inherent flaws of the early Revloc design. (such as "not slipping enough upon a jump landing with the throttle on, and damaging transmission parts". Since then, after Rekluse had addressed this problem in the engineering of their design, Revloc also addressed this problem.) The Revlocs worked very well on the bikes I rode.

Rekluse has always been easy to contact, and happy to discuss their product and listen to feedback. When they first came out with their no-stall offering, and i called them on the phone, they were very interested in GasGas applications; especially when I told them that GasGas used basically the same standard clutch in their 200, 250, 300, & 4-stroke models. (In the 200, the drive gear on the back of the clutch basket has a different number of teeth. Other than that, they are all the same, except for the "slipper clutch" in the 2005 FSE450.) I liked what they said so much that I sent them a complete GasGas clutch to use to be able to engineer their set-up for us. In 2004, I met and rode with them in the Sawtooth Range in Idaho. They were great to deal with.
They were accessable to talk with every time I called them, which I did a lot while I was doing R&D for them for the first couple of years.

GasGas doesn't use the Honda CR250 spec plates. The friction discs are very close, but the Honda clutch uses only 7 friction discs, which are 3mm thick. The GasGas friction discs (8 used) are 2.7mm thick. The hubs are different, which makes the metal drive plates different.

I used my Rekluse auto clutch for 2.5 years in my 2006 DE300. I ride a lot of mountain singletrack, and a lot of technical riding. The clutch worked great for me, especially after a lot of experiment with different set-ups. Here is the set-up that I found worked best and what I used:
I used ten tungsten balls and twenty steel balls.
I started with .028" freeplay, and by the time the clutch started showing any difference in operation, the freeplay was always right around .040" to .042".
I used a full 1000cc of Amsoil 0w40 4-stroke engine oil.
I changed my final gearing to 13/52. (I found that it "took off from a dead stop on the side of a really steep hill climb without wheelie-ing" much better with this lowered gearing, and the slower "speed of engagement" it allowed.)

I had several of the Rekluse drive plates (both thicknesses) to go with my remaining (left over) GasGas drive plates, and as soon as the freeplay got toward the upper end of the range, I would swap the drive plates in order to keep the freeplay where I liked it.

One more thing.
Remember that I stated that I was doing R&D for Rekluse for 2.5 years.
I found that the original Rekluse replacement brake pedal pivot (used to make more room for the expanded clutch cover) was a bit soft. Mine bent within three weeks of use.
When I called Rekluse about the bent pivot, they had a new, stronger and harder pivot to me within a week. (I asked them for a steel pivot, but they sent me a hardened alloy pivot. Even though I am not currently running the Rekluse clutch in my '06, I'm still using that brake pedal pivot. It has not bent yet. I figure that it is what they have been sending out with the clutch orders ever since then.)

Let us know how it goes, and what you find out.

Good Riding!

Jim

 

[Keg]

I have ordered a EXP Core Clutch.

I have a Revloc in a box but have not decided to use it. If they bring out a slave cylinder with a bolt adjuster (behind the piston to give you the specific clearance in the basket) I would consider using it. I hate the idea of pre-loading the hydraulic system from the master cylinder reservoir.

But they are only talking about making a KTM one at the moment and I have had the Revloc clutch sitting here for a couple of months now.

 

[gasser]

Does it soften up the 300 any making it easier to ride?

Skidad I rode the new 250 and 300 gassers back to back and the 300 had the core EXP. Yes the rekluse clutch took just a bit of jerk out of the 300. Hook up was still positive and quick - I was completely sold and can't wait to get one for my bike.
One thing that did jump out at me was that the 300 felt much more planted and solid in the front end compared to the 250. The 250 was skittish up front like my 07 300. I wonder if the slighter quicker engagement of the manual clutch was lifting the front end and causing this. Both bikes had the same suspension but the 250 had a bib in the front tire while the 300 was running a tube.

 

[SpeedyManiac]

Question for you guys with the EXP. My girlfriend just put one in her 2011 EC250 and we're not impressed. The biggest issue is the override does not feel like stock. I've read through everything about adjusting the gap and minimizing free play gain, but the clutch still seems to get too much free play gain and at extremely high RPMs the override does not completely work. I set the dial-a-gap at 1 turn + 5 ticks as recommended by Rekluse.

The only thing I'm wondering is if maybe there's a bit of air in the clutch line causing the problem (though with the stock clutch it was fine) or I simply need a larger clutch master cylinder that will move more fluid and push the throw-out a little bit farther.

By the way, the clutch is fine cold, but it worsens as it heats up.