Tentative: 2010 KTM 350SX-F

[MattR]

Interesting first look at the tentative 2010 KTM 350SX-F...
EFI and rear shock linkage.

Here is an article discussing the highlights:
http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/666/5029/Motorcycle-Article/2010-KTM-350-SX-F-First-Look.aspx

 

[gasgasman]

Can Am is back.

 

[Skidad]

It's freaking awesome IMO. Notice it also has an available spot for a kick start kit which is nice.

If they had a woods version available now lines would be forming. To bad it may take up to 2 years to get it out. Who knows if it will be PDS or linkage at that point. Will KTM go back to linkage or keep both versions going. Kind of a cross roads for them now that they have this thing coming (and it is coming).

Here is a very high resolution pic of the bike

http://www.ktm.com/uploads/pics/ktm_sx-f_350_persp_srgb.jpg

 

[GMP]

Very nice, it would be the perfect displacement as long as the package was not a sleeved down 450. Essentially they are admitting defeat as far as PDS is concerned if this comes to production.

How about a 350 Husaberg, new 60 deg motor, scaled down a bit with linkage?

 

[Skidad]

KTM finally has PDS working really good now (yes it took 10 years). Defeat...I don't think so but MX market share may drive this more than anything...and Stefan Everetts. KTM won a couple MX championships in Europe this year I think so PDS does work and is more accepted in other countries than the US. Even MX Action loved the PDS suspension on the 2010 450SXF, the whole bike in fact. It is allot more sensitive to setup and there in lies the biggest problem. Personally I would buy that 350 either way

I think they will continue the off road bikes with PDS and MX will move to linkage. It would be kind of silly to offer a bike both ways but they kind of are opening a big can of worms with the linkage bike. Next few years will be interesting to see what happens.

The 350 is an entirely new motor BTW but strongly based off the 250 motor NOT the 400/450 motor.

 

[Cruiser]

The big issue with the pds is they work great if set up right,, but they work great for a smaller window of conditions than a linkage system.. The 97 PDS that was on the 200exc JP edition/early release of the pds 200cc bikes worked better than most generations of the WP pds.. If they stayed with ohlins who knows how the pds would have been by now..

 

[Cruiser]

In the hi-res pic of the 350 does the casting of the cyl look odd to anybody else? kinda reminds me of the casting process saturn used on the dohc 4 cyl engines they had in the early cars.. looked like aluminium styrofoam..

 

[gasgasman]

looked like aluminium styrofoam..

That casting process is called "lost foam casting".
The parts are made from styrofoam which are covered with a ceramic forming mold. The hot molten metal is poured into the forming mold, which vaporizes the styrofoam, forming the parts.

Gas Gas uses sand casting. The parts are made from moist putty like sand. The sand parts are then covered with a hard ceramic forming mold. When the sand drys, it is then removed from the ceramic forming mold. The void is then filled with molten aluminum, creating the final parts.

FYI. Freeze plugs on car engines are actually ports to remove the casting sand from the engine block.

 

[GMP]

KTM screwed Ohlins. They had Ohlins develop the PDS, with the intent of a production order. They then bought WP and cut Ohlins loose. Nice guys. They could not use the Ohlins design however. The Ohlins PDS used two pistons of different diameters, the smaller of which engaged a stepped down bore at the end of the stroke. This is what I had on my Cannondale, and I can say for sure that it worked better than any KTM I have ever ridden. No needle BS and flow problems.

 

[AZRickD]

Linkless is the way to go for the rough and tumble Enduro Cross circuit. Destry Abbot broke his swing-arm components trying to slam over a concrete barrier.

 

[GMP]

Not all linkages are positioned the same. So, with a PDS, you would smash the swingarm directlty on the same obstacle.

The GG linkage, IMO, is quite stout compared to some others. Perhaps this is where a couple extra lbs come from, but you know I'll take the weight for reliability. I have hammered all kinds of rocks, wheelie up ledges, off drop offs, RR tracks, etc., and have never had a problem that would make me think PDS would be an advantage.

 

[kneehurts]

KTM PDS vs linkage

I agree with Cruiser that the WP PDS could be made to work very well in a narrow range of conditions. I frequently felt as if I had to adjust the shock halfway through the 1st lap of an HS race. IMHO there always seemed to be a greater compromise between working well in rock/roots vs whoops compared to a linkage equipped machine.

 

[noobi]

Well I had a ride on one of these today, my mate is one of the first people in the country to test ride it. So naturally I had a go aswell.

Its not bad, fuel pump noises are a bit strange, but the suspension seemed to work pretty well on some gnarly roots and bumps when moving, considering its a mx bike and I weigh about 6kg... so I was surprised to still be attached after riding over some wash outs and stuff, it also tracked relatively well over off camber slippery roots, which I didnt expect.

It handles well, but only when your moving, it doesnt like going slow, at all, the suspension gets all sketchy at very slow speeds, but once moving, 2nd and 3rd gear stuff it was pretty nice.

It doesnt feel like a KTM either, which I dont like the feel of at all, but this 350 feels somewhere in between a gg chassis and the ktm one, just in the riding position, its very consistent in its size between your legs, may sound strange but I didnt enjoy riding the ktms that I have because the frame feels odd.

The engine is good, the efi makes it rideable in the snotty yuck clay, but the throttle was so light I got arm pump trying to keep in steady, its got plenty of power but doesnt have that big snap right off idle that efi 450s have, so I didnt face plant any trees, but the throttle is directly attached to the rear wheel but in a very linear kind of way, not too agro, I only had one throttle related indiscretion, the damn throttle is soo light.

The clutch seemed to be heavy compared to other bikes iv ridden, still got nothing on the gg clutch, brakes were also pretty touchy, had it swap ends on me a few times.

So I dunno, it would take a bit of work to get me onto one, put some resistance on that throttle, sort the suspension for slow speed, a fww maybe.
Anyone else ridden one yet?

 

[Skidad]

Just wait for the 350 off road version which could arrive this fall. This will deal with some of the issues you were having riding a MX bike off road.

It just may be the perfect all around size. Unless they F up the off road 350 (not likely) these are gonna be a HUGE seller weather they come with PDS or linkage. It should also have a 6 speed tranny where the SXF version is a 5 speed.