Ec 300 2008

[Jacob 'Berg]

While waiting for jets'n needle, did a ride with:
N1EF #1
168
42
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0A43YNhKJ8&feature=youtu.be



Now, Jacob 'Bergs settings came in sooner, so today installed

CEK#3
175
38

Difference (quick test) is: more power everywhere, smoothed transition to valve, meaty torque.
Have yet to test it in real terrain.
On the other hand..its super LEAN, at least in hi rpm range.. So, Jacob, raising needle or giving a go to bigger main?

Try a 178 main. If it is better, but still lean on top, go with the 180. If you still feel it is lean after richening up the main, go to position #4 and start leaning the main out until it is running smooth at all throttle openings.

 

[5valve]

Tried 178 - lean, 180 - lean, no matter the clip position, except full raised not tested.
Im thinking either 182 or 185, which I dont have to test.
Also, next ritcher needle from CEK at middle openings is CCK and at middle to top throtthle is DCK.
So deciding between needle or jets.
Have whole range from 168 to 180.

Pilot jet, I believe, could still be lowered from 38, being tad ritch at idle, but at the moment I'm keeping it, since all but idle is on the lean side, so I get enough fuel at least on small openings.


Of course inconsistent idle is still present, from barely running, to high idle.
Both idle speeds would be acceptable, I they wouldn't change back and forth.

Fine tuning (idle knob and air) can't make it run any other rpm than super slow or tad high.
Which ever of the two speeds I adjust it to idle, it isn't fixed, but again it autoselects speed, based on bike inclination and other undefined parameters.

 

[Jacob 'Berg]

Sounds like you have an air leak somewhere? That would explain the erratic idle. Seems to me you should be in the ballpark with the CEK at higher clip positions and with the richer jets. I just moved to clip position #4 on the CEK as it starting to warm up here and bike was starting to run rich.

 

[5valve]

Since topic is old but alive, I refreshed top and bottom end, all gaskets, seals.
It's winter time here, so cold.
I'll post my settings, for better understanding of the whole picture.

New wossner piston
0.5mm base gasket (previously 1mm, and before that 1.3mm)
1.45mm squish (moved it closer to the upper suggested limit 1.1 - 1.5, as advised by tuner)
12.7:1 compression, head modded

AS1
PJ 38
MJ 178
CEK#3 and #4

#3 makes it pretty unrideable in slow, steep, technical stuff, but in open it rolls.
#4 transforms it into excellent crawler, pretty much like a 4T, little wheelspin, tractable up to 1/2 throtthle.
Snow riding 3rd, 4th gear, uphill, mid rpms, it just excels, with little handlebar pull, very predictable, with much grunt.
Bike clears quickly when going on pipe after prolongued low rpm cold riding. In winter a thermostat would be better, to keep some heat.

Still some carb fiddling is needed, as bike is tad rich down low.
Rarely ride it pinned for extended time, could be lean at top rpm's, but no need to fix it atm, as we mostly ride slow to mid rpms with occasional bursts uphill.

 

[adriano.ro]

gassergrant, its Slovenia, just outside capital. "small" patch of forrest, hills, creeks, fire roads, about 30s from my house.

So Jakobi's advice is to use N3EG combo, practically identical to gassergant 's.
Is this jetting combo N3EG#3, 38-40, 178 tempeture sensitive for winter/summer jets changes being a must, or just finetuning of air screw and maybe needle height is enough to compensate?
Riding temeratures range from 23F to 95F, mostly being in 50/77 range. Never extremely humid.


I do have in grasp KTM needles, N84K, N2ZK, N2ZW and N2ZL, but being "2", I presume are not OK.
Jets i have enough, to test.

CCK and CEK are keihin brand needles, do they correlate to any OEM?

I dont have JD spreadsheet.

I have the same needle N2ZW,did you try this? For now I have this and N1EF,and I just ordered N3EG. CCK ,I read good things about this needle but seems to decrease mpg. Anyway just take a look at this video,where I use 40 N2ZW@3 175 7slide temp ~5℃ elevation arounde 700m.

https://youtu.be/9SGYsSt971g

Good tourqe but away too rich in 1/8-11
/4 whit no spoonge?!!

 

[adriano.ro]

gassergrant, its Slovenia, just outside capital. "small" patch of forrest, hills, creeks, fire roads, about 30s from my house.

So Jakobi's advice is to use N3EG combo, practically identical to gassergant 's.
Is this jetting combo N3EG#3, 38-40, 178 tempeture sensitive for winter/summer jets changes being a must, or just finetuning of air screw and maybe needle height is enough to compensate?
Riding temeratures range from 23F to 95F, mostly being in 50/77 range. Never extremely humid.


I do have in grasp KTM needles, N84K, N2ZK, N2ZW and N2ZL, but being "2", I presume are not OK.
Jets i have enough, to test.

CCK and CEK are keihin brand needles, do they correlate to any OEM?

I dont have JD spreadsheet.

I have the same needle N2ZW,did you try this? For now I have this and N1EF,and I just ordered N3EG. CCK ,I read good things about this needle but seems to decrease mpg. Anyway just take a look at this video,for me,seams too rich,where I use 40 N2ZW@3 175 7slide temp ~5℃ elevation arounde 700m.

https://youtu.be/9SGYsSt971g

Good tourqe but away too rich in 1/8-11
/4 but whit no spoonge?!!
And why N2xx aren't good?

 

[Jakobi]

Z is the needle diameter of the straight section of the needle. It covers idle to 1/8-1/4 depending on the needles taper profile. Sizes range from:

Nxxx needle diameters
D=2.685mm
E=2.695mm (JD Blue)
F=2.705mm
G= 2.715
H= 2.725
W/I=2.735 (JD Red)
J= 2.745
K=2.755

In 1/2 clip variations from leanest to richest they are...
N89x=leanest
N3Cx
N3Ex
N8Rx
N2Zx
N4Dx
N3Vx
N4Ax
N6Mx=richest


So N2ZW#3 is on par with N3EW#2.

 

[adriano.ro]

So my n2zw too lean. I will try one again whit n1ef ,I want to stay away from lean part. I have also NOZH.

I will receive next jetts in about 3 weeks.
Tnx Jakobi once again.

 

[adriano.ro]

Witch pilot an main to use with n1ef?

 

[lonetree]

throw that bloody n1xx needle away, will only cause trouble. i have a 09 and had a 250 and 300. im at sea level and love the n3XXneedles, pilots are around 38, with 178-180 mains, the older carbies tend to need a slightly richer setting.

 

[adriano.ro]

I will use n1ef only for one ride,I just ordered N3EG. But I will order even a suzuki needle,on 200 works so well. NEDG need to do good job.

 

[5valve]

I only experiment with CEK for now.

What i don't understand is, how could a CCK needle, which I believe is thicker in every aspect as N1EF, have more consumption, except if you ride it harder, because it hits better.

I do notice, that my CEK is in 8.5-8.7 L/100km range (27 us mpg), riding from sea, up to 1600 ft, very few excessive throtthling, lot of climbing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWhV4PqCzLI

long video, but ffwding random locations shows riding style of which I measured consumption.

 

[adriano.ro]

Someone use #9 slide? Is to lean? My friend bike ec 300 '04 pilot 40 #9 slide N1EF@3 175 ,runs good,no booging at all,instant acceleration,start very good,a little bit too lean on main jet. If I change from #7 to #9 I will lose bottom end power? If #7 is more rich ,that mean more torque,or?

Sorry for my bad english

 

[adriano.ro]

some work to my friend.

 

[MJC]

Someone use #9 slide? Is to lean? My friend bike ec 300 '04 pilot 40 #9 slide N1EF@3 175 ,runs good,no booging at all,instant acceleration,start very good,a little bit too lean on main jet. If I change from #7 to #9 I will lose bottom end power? If #7 is more rich ,that mean more torque,or?

Sorry for my bad english

You may actually pick up a little bit down low, but you will lose some throttle response.

I bounce back and forth between a #7, a 7.5 custom slide, and a #8 slide, depending on which needle I use. I have never used a #9 slide before though.

 

[adriano.ro]

Needle update. I put in N3EG @3 p40 mj180 now the bike runs great. Very responsive,clean power with just a little bit of burbbles but nothing bad. But,I feel the 1/2- wot a bit to soft,I mean power is there but is not so easy to rise the front wheel up,gear is 13-49. My question is how the bike will go with n3eg @4 p38 mj178. I know,I need to try myself to feel the difference but 3 weeks I can ride and I'm so curious

 

[adriano.ro]

I'm still too lean somewhere, I feel that and the spark plug looks on the same way. The main jet 180 is just 'normal' for this needle.I will rise up the needle one step, with pj38.

Jakobi sounds logical wath I'm think to do?

 

[Flashlight]

Needle update. I put in N3EG @3 p40 mj180 now the bike runs great. Very responsive,clean power with just a little bit of burbbles but nothing bad. But,I feel the 1/2- wot a bit to soft,I mean power is there but is not so easy to rise the front wheel up,gear is 13-49. My question is how the bike will go with n3eg @4 p38 mj178. I know,I need to try myself to feel the difference but 3 weeks I can ride and I'm so curious

I found the best setup for my 2006 ec 300 was a N3EG in the second position with a 178 main and 42 pilot. When I tried the N3EG in the third position it was slower to pull through half throttle to WOT and got the occasional burble in the single track. Didn't try the fourth as I'm sure that was too rich.

When I tried the 40 pilot I got very crisp throttle response but a lean bog in high load situations unless the aircrew was only a 1/2 turn out. The 42 also started better. A 38 would be too lean for mine.

I also run the half clip leaner N3CG (42 and 178) in the third position for a slightly different feel. It is a little less abrupt.

I also like the CCK in the second position and a 42 pilot, but run that with a 175 main.

Sounds like you're getting close.

 

[adriano.ro]

Hmm, so I will try 42 n3eg@2 180,I can't find 178. I like so much the power delivery of this needles. I saw only good things about CCK and CEK,but the consumption seams to be less efficient.

 

[Jakobi]

I'm still too lean somewhere, I feel that and the spark plug looks on the same way. The main jet 180 is just 'normal' for this needle.I will rise up the needle one step, with pj38.

Jakobi sounds logical wath I'm think to do?

Be methodical. Make one change at a time with intent to address a specific throttle position.

Given that clip position is 1) easy to change, and 2) covers the broadest range of throttle.. this is where I would start.

For my conditions clip 4 would be too rich, however your temps are much lower and its safer to go rich first. I'd try moving only the needle to position 4. Ride and test. If it improves go richer again.. if not move leaner and see if you see improvement.