HOw do i go DC on my ec300

Hi!

Yes, I meant tachometer... Sorry for my language! In three weeks I am going to "float the stator" having all possible documentation and a friend helping. I am going to take many pictures along the way. Today I measured the ac voltage of the free white wire under the tank. It reached 24 V AC with medium rpms.

Merry Christmas and a Happy new year 2008!

Leon
 
Yes, I agree. I think this is what I was trying to say. The stator mod removes
the ground path from the stator plate to the motor/frame. Sends two wires
up from the stator that go into the TrailTech Rectifier/Regulator. There are the
two yellow wires entering the Retcifier. Connect the yellow wire from the stator
to one of the yellow wires from the rectifier and connect the white wire from
the stator to the other yellow wire from the rectifier. Then connect the Red
wire from The Rectifier to the (+) side of the battery and the black wire from
the Rectifier to the (-) side of the battery.
http://trailtech.net/media/electrical/dc_conversions/ktm_dc_conversion.pdf
The Rectifier I received from TrailTech has 5 wires. Two yellow, one red, one black
and one blue wire. According to Trail tech. The blue wire is used to limit the
charging rate into a small motorcycle battery. So as not to over charge it.
http://www.trailtech.net/tech_support_electrical_accessories.html
So i need to figure out if I need to plug the blue wire into the battery
and use the red wire to power my lights etc... Or use the battery to power
everything........
This is getting old and must be frustrating for those of you that understand how all this works.
I am just trying to get it right the first time and not fry something valuable.
I know this is not rocket science and can't figure out why I am having such
a hard time getting the complete concept to lock into my brain. I am sure
it will seem "So simple" once I get it figured out.
---------------------- Damn, I just checked this again. I may be seeing the error
in my thinking.
http://www.bajadesigns.com/2005 Web Site/PDF Files/BATREG3.pdf
I seems the first diagram shows the black wire from the Rectifier going
to the frame for ground. And the (-) wire from the battery also being
grounded to the frame.
So what about the second diagram? It shows the Stator grounded to
the frame and one of the yellow wires also grounded..?!?!?! Is this not
to be used with a Full Wave Rectifier???
I need another drink and spend another night tossing and turning in bed
thinking about this..... Good night and have a Merry Christmas.
Jeff... I feel so SloCalSpode'ly
 
slocal,

You are getting confused becaue you are looking at two options. The BajaDesigns PDF is basically showing you one option that is what I said about an isolated DC system, that retains the stator ground. The other is the floating AC grounded DC method. Decide what you want to do and follow one path.

I suggest floating the ground and using the Trailtech rect/reg. Get the part and follow the conversion.pdf and you will be fine. The Blue wire is a current limited output for a smaller, lighweight battery. You may need to find out from them (is it in the instructions/) what Ah rating battery limit this is applicable to.
 
Hi!

Yesterday me and a friend tried to go DC on my EC250 07 following the 2nd diagram without modifying the stator. It worked! Just follow the diagram in the previous post. The HID front light worked even with only one of the two AC wires from the stator.

Finally we connected both ac wires (yellow and white) to one of the two yellow wires of the reg/rec to get max charging power because I am planning to use the battery to power the trail tech helmet lights as well.

The other yellow wire from the DC reg/rec you use it as frame ground (as in the picture... I understand it as the completion of the loop for the AC side so no short circuit appears on the system? ). I bought a snowmobile DC regulator meant for use with electric start.

The black and red wires from the regulator to negative and positive of the battery (1,3 Ah). Mount it on plastic in order to avoid DC ground. I mounted it in the airbox on the plastic base (under the filter, opposite from cdi) making two holes for the screws.

I mounted the battery above the filter creating an aluminium "bridge" using the subframe. The seat will keep it in place. From battery and via a fuse and simple switch (no ground connection!) the black and red wires to the negative and positive of the HID light.

Today I am finishing the wiring and adding the connections to the taillight. I hope the hydraulic brake switch doesn't cause any ground problem. As I think it, it shouldn't because it should act as an "allow - don't allow current" through the positive wire of the battery to the light?

The most time of this mod goes to wiring and thinking of where the battery and DC regulator can be mounted.

Thank you for all your help! I hope my post helps you!

Leon
 
You went with the isolated DC ground method. Thats fine, just be careful of any shorts to the frame.
 
Thanks Leon for the follow up. I am glad to hear your path to DC
worked.
I am assuming you used the second, (bottom), diagram from this
link.
http://www.bajadesigns.com/2005 Web Site/PDF Files/BATREG3.pdf
I am using the first. (top), diagram for my conversion. Using a "floating
ground" modified stator.
I hope mine works when I get it finished.
I wish I understood the advantages or disadvantages of one method
over the other. As your way seems WAY easier.
I am waiting for the Timming shim gismo for my 2K3 stator. It is on order.
thanks for the post and enjoy your HID lights!
Jeff
 
Hi!

Yes, the bottom diagram I used. I just didn't want to mess with the stator. I spent 4 more hours yesterday to complete the wiring and create supports for the switch and the battery. (In one hour I can go back to oem electric setup for the summer because I left the oem harness on the frame, removing only the crap light switch) Almost an hour went to tapping the metal connectors. At the end we tested with the battery empty after allowing to charge a bit at around idle. Headlight hid and two trailtech hid helmet lights started without any problem. The rear light worked as it was supposed to work.

Only problem came with a universal kill switch. It didn't work after I connected it with the gray and black wires of the harness as the gasgas diagram shows. It has to do with the ground connection (black wire) to the frame. It was getting very late and I let it be for the time. If somebody can suggest something, I will be very thankful!

Soon I will have a digital camera and take some pictures of the setup.

Leon
 
old new guy (do the stator mod)

Hi, I've been watching you guys talk about the different ways to do this stator/hid lights and went to work on mine. I've got tht 2k3 stator.
Buy it self without mod through a battery, max out put is just under 2.3 amps at 11.73 volts thats 26.9 watts, doesn't matter if you use the white or the yellow it comes out the same. I read that one of you guys were going to hook the white with the yellow, yes you will get a spike of juce but it will be short lived and you will soon be replaceing your stator so please don't. Flooting the ground is really simple if you take your time it may take up to 30 minnets. This is what you'll really get, with the light on drawing between3.1 and 3.5 amps you will have a charge at the battery 13.35 to 13.71. This is all dependent on wheather you put extra raps on the last pole.
I work for Northern Lights the generator people I'm one of the QA people int the test cell area.
I've also tested this with the Hid an a set of 12v-25 whatt lights in pairs and still have 13.1 volt at the battery Next I want to try a pair of 35 watts and see if I can keep the volts above 12.5. Till it drops bellow 12.5 I really won't know what the max out is. O by the way, I am useing the Trail tec rec and do not recomend any thing else, it is worth the money many times over.
 
Thanks Steve. I think you need to hang around here a bit more and re-visit
this thread once in a while. I know I appreciate the insight and knowledge
I may learn from from these, and your, posts.
I am the one doing the floating ground mod with the TrailTech Rectifier.
I did the mod, but, believe me. It took more than 30 min. I guess I fell
asleep in shop class the day they covered soldering. Took me a few
times to get a decent solder joint.
I am still waiting on the timing shim for my 2K3 stator. After that it
is figuring out the connectors and how I want to wire it together. I plan
on putting a master switch and a fuse. I may also go with a key switch
on the speedo dash like the 4-strokes for some added security.
It would be nice to have a couple "how I did it" tech reports for the
forum. I'll try and write something up with pictures when I get finished.
Thanks, Jeff
 
Hi!

Thank you for your input! I connected the white and yellow wire from the stator to one of the two wires of the dc regulator. Can you elaborate more on why it will damage the stator? Have you got any stator failed because of this? Is this white wire available free on the frame only for the case you float the ground? I measured its voltage when I found it while the bike was working with the oem lights on and it reached 25V AC (not much) at less than half throttle. So, it seems that the power of the white wire and of the yellow wire can be summed together.

The DC rec/reg I used is pretty similar to the trailtech reg and in the same price category. It corresponds exactly to the dc reg of the diagram above with two yellow, one red and one black wire. I remember that when we measured the voltage at the battery with the hid on it was something like 14V +. I have to ask still my friend because he took the measurement.

Until now I rode three times the bike and no problems. Yesterday night I was using the hid front light and the two trailtech helmet lights. I started with an empty battery (after experiments with a hid projector in the yard with the bike off), the battery charged with the lights off during warm up (max 3 min) and the hids started ok when I started driving. Then for 1 hour everything worked ok.

I still have to measure the voltage at the battery to be sure. Please elaborate more on the stator failure.

Waiting for your reply.

Leon
 
Hi again!

I wanted to add that more people here in Finland insist that you do not have to do the stator mod on a 2 stroke (especially the KTMs and GasGas having the 2k3 stator) in order to run HID as long as you follow the isolated dc ground method and you have the correct dc reg. This mod is necessary on 4 strokes with a starter in order to use together the AC side (powering the lights) and DC powering the battery for the starter.

Even a company called EMX from Sweden selling various electric parts for KTMs to run HID, inform that on 2T KTMs with the 2k3 you do not need the stator mod when using their expensive dc regulator (100 euros) and similar (if not the same) to trailtech reg.

Still waiting for your answer about the stator failure on GasGas. Is it that the power of lets say the white wire can loop backwards to the coil of the yellow wire and burn it? Can this really happen? Checking the diagram and the ground connections it seems safe to me to connect together the two wires to the dc rec.

I asked my friend and he confirmed that he saw 14V (enough to keep it charged) at the battery when the hids were on.

Leon
 
I read that one of you guys were going to hook the white with the yellow, yes you will get a spike of juce but it will be short lived and you will soon be replaceing your stator so please don't.
Click to expand...


Finally we connected both ac wires (yellow and white) to one of the two yellow wires of the reg/rec to get max charging power because I am planning to use the battery to power the trail tech helmet lights as well.
Click to expand...


After reading this again after awhile I think that Steve is correct. The yellow and white AC wires from the stator should be out of phase with respect to each other, as they are on different polls, not in parallell like on the core of a transformer. Its an 8 pole stator, so that means a 45 deg phase angle between adjacent poles.

What this means is that there will be some potential between the windings, as well as a potential from each to their common AC (stator) ground.
 
Thank you for the reply! I will be disconnecting the white wire from the connections but still I am not sure that there should be a problem on the stator. I fully understand that this kind of connection could cause problem on a 3 phase floated stator but not really on stator where two different coils are grounded. Please Steve elaborate on this possible failure.

Thank you!

Leon
 
I think the link you provided is for a Halogen bulb and not an HID.
"Osram 65W H7 bulb" Filliment bulbs can run on either AC or DC.
But I believe an HID needs true DC.
If you can, and it appears you have, get a good DC current with
out doing the "Floating Ground" mod you can run a HID system.
Depending of current output from the stator you may or may not
be draining the battery with your lights on.
For my case. I doubt I will be riding with the lights on for more
than an hour or two. I suppose I could have just used a constant
loss battery system to power my lights. I may be going "Over Kill"
for my intended purpose.
"Anything worth doing, is worth over doing"
I want to have a fully street legal bike when I am finished.
Jeff So. Cal. USA
 
The point is that they connect together the white and yellow wires from the stator without problems (as I did and it seems to work fine until now). Not that hid needs dc and halogen can run on ac. I am really against any mod on the bike if it is not needed. The whole floating ground of 2T 2K3 stators thing on the net to me seems like a big advertizment campaign to sell the work plus the famous rectifiers regulators. I just checked my dc regulator and it is exactly the same as the one trail tech sells for dc conversion on KTM and Yamaha YZF450. Exactly.

Anyway, as I have the wiring it is really easy to disconnect the white wire from the system. I just need more facts before I do it because until now the whole thing works.
 
longivity VRS quick fix

I've been messin with stators for a long time, most are high volyage but they all work on the same principal. You have as stock two compleate stators within them selves. White to ground and yellow to ground,they are such low voltage and low amp they very well may work along time befor they self destruct. Try jumping a dead battery with small cable, the cable will get really hot and may do the job but for only a short time. it's simlar to what you are trying to do, sence its ac you may even gain a few amps but the coils are fighting them selves and it is only a matter of time befor ouch. After I did the mod I took theyellow and split it .the end from the stator goes to the reg the other to the positive on the battery. Even without the batt in place stock stuff works fine,only better because it hase a cleaner voltage. The puller you need is a 27mm left hand thread.Take your time,about 30 minets and presto belive me it's worth the effort and you will be glad you did it. steve
 
My father in law who is an automation technician in a company he suggested to do a simple test. If a small lamp is working when you connect it to the two stator wires then you shouldn't connect them together. I did the test and the lamp worked. The two coils are not in phase "competing" for power. The good news is that using only the yellow wire to the dc reg I still get good charging to the battery and hids work.

Thank you Steve for mentioning this potential problem!
 
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