Local Race

[Rod Overstreet]

I am a business man, so I tend to look at things in that way, and the way the lower classes are currently run is bad business, and local organizers wonder why the sport is on life support. Please understand my rant is not because I am taking it serious (at least for myself). If 80%+ of my revenue came from little league, then you bet I'd be on top of it, making those folks feel like priority. Don't confuse the glamour of pro racing, with the grassroots effort that keeps our sport alive.

In the real world NFL pro ball brings more money to the table than any amateur series an thus takes priority. In the dirt bike world, the amateur classes bring more to the table than the pros. The pros exists because of the amateur riders and the products they buy. So why not cater to them more? Make the focus on them?

Just debating for conversation sake. at this point...

I agree. We are watching the lower class entries dwindle at an alarming rate, and those guys pay the bills.

 

[Rod Overstreet]

I move to A when I meet the criteria stated in the rules of my series. Which in my case would be:
A" Class
a. All "B" Class Champions and "B" riders ranked second or third in the previous year's IXCR who won at least three races.
b. All riders that have an "A" ranking in any other off-road series. c. Exception section 5 guidelines.

So if I win the Vet B championship in 2016 I move to A. If I finish in 2nd or 3rd and win 3 races or more I move to A. Now this year an interesting scenario came about that seems a little unfair. There was a 3 way tie for 1st. Place in the Vet B class this year. None of the 3 won 3 races. So the only guy to move up is the winner. The only reason he won is because he had the highest finish at the last race. Now that being said I know all three of these guys and 2 are going to A and the other (2nd place guy) is sliding over to Senior B. So technically he is still in B but he is moving to an "easier" class. Lol

As for me I will continue to move up when I am suppose to. I could ride Vet A next year and finish in the top 10 every race but why would I do that when I can ride B and be competitive.

Gosh I had never put this much thought into all this! I just go out there and ride my hardest and then look at my lap times at the end of the race to make sure I didn't fall off as the race went on. Then I go look at my overall and see where I stack up. This was my first year racing and I used the C class as a starting point. My riding came a long way this year and now it's time to move up. The stacks of $5 plaques in my garage mean jack shit compared to the fun I had and the friends I made along the way!

Rod I do agree we need the AMA I was just saying they don't have the manpower to police every race for sandbaggers. If someone in your series/class is doing so then it's on you to point it out to the AMA.


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And Let me just say you rode very well this year. I had a great time that ONE time we rode together. Well...that lasted 15 seconds until you passed me

 

[memphis2857]

I agree. We are watching the lower class entries dwindle at an alarming rate, and those guys pay the bills.

The last round of the GNCC had 800 bikes in the AM race which consist of only C classes and the Sportsman A and B class. The 2 sportsman classes account for about 100 of the 800 entries. So that leaves nearly 700 C class entries in one race. The afternoon race which is Pro, A, and B classes you had 271 entries. So I would say we definitely need to take care of the C riders that some, well one person here considers to be not worth the effort because their lap times are 5 or even 10 minutes slower than the 10 or 15 pros that showed up to race.


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[gasgasxc]

Thanks

Haven't heard much from you on specifics as far as this subject goes.
Ive seen some I knew a guy once and a little of this and that,but I don't have a clear picture on how you break down the Amateur sand bagging issues.

Faults and fixes kind of thing,Specifics.
Class structure.
More classes?
Less classes?
When its time to move a rider.
Who decides.
How would you decide?
How does that affect the class he moves into.How does that effect the class he exits from.
Where does that stop??
Should we keep classes strong and competitive.
Or dilute the classes above.
Does that create a cycle that will not end?
Where would it end?
Do you like the idea of Expert and Amateur classes only with no classes within a class.
Do you like an ISDE format.E1-E2-E3 in a Pro.Expert and Amateur only.
Could you simplify,If you aren't a pro you are an expert,if you aren't an expert you are an amateur.
Who really gives a shit?
Who should??

Lets hear it.

 

[memphis2857]

So from a business standpoint the A.M. race brought in $34,380 in entry fees alone. The afternoon race brought in $13,800 that's including the higher fee for the pros. But the GNCC paid back every penny of the pros entry fee to the winners. Imagine what the gate fee numbers would be!


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[12Bravo]

Haven't heard much from you on specifics as far as this subject goes.
Ive seen some I knew a guy once and a little of this and that,but I don't have a clear picture on how you break down the Amateur sand bagging issues.

Faults and fixes kind of thing,Specifics.
Class structure.
More classes?
Less classes?
When its time to move a rider.
Who decides.
How would you decide?
How does that affect the class he moves into.How does that effect the class he exits from.
Where does that stop??
Should we keep classes strong and competitive.
Or dilute the classes above.
Does that create a cycle that will not end?
Where would it end?
Do you like the idea of Expert and Amateur classes only with no classes within a class.
Do you like an ISDE format.E1-E2-E3 in a Pro.Expert and Amateur only.
Could you simplify,If you aren't a pro you are an expert,if you aren't an expert you are an amateur.
Who really gives a shit?
Who should??

Lets hear it.

I'd like to see you answer all the above.

Lets hear it.....

 

[gasgasxc]

I'd like to see you answer all the above.

Lets hear it.....

You are adding absolutely nothing to this topic other then noise.
If you read through my posts I have.
I do not think you have anything specific to add to the topic.

Im asking someone that may have to lay it out from his point of view.
Specifics.

RC cars you said?

 

[12Bravo]

So from a business standpoint the A.M. race brought in $34,380 in entry fees alone. The afternoon race brought in $13,800 that's including the higher fee for the pros. But the GNCC paid back every penny of the pros entry fee to the winners. Imagine what the gate fee numbers would be!


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My take on this, as I am just starting to understand and want to race.

It's like a company, take care of the employees and the employees will take care of the company. So, the vast majority need to be factored into this topic with fairness and understanding that some have honest intent to move up and other don't care and want to just take up space.

But where do I fall into this. I want to ride, but to poor to race a full series. So am I limited to the Sportsmans class where weekend warriors run away with all the local events or do I just focus on the final standing and just go with the flow.

I think I will just look at final standings, not class structure and see how I place in final standings as a motivational factor to me. This is how I went from a nobody "Redneck" with a bow to a National and World competitor in the Olympic Archery sport.

 

[VxZeroKnots]

My take on this, as I am just starting to understand and want to race.

It's like a company, take care of the employees and the employees will take care of the company. So, the vast majority need to be factored into this topic with fairness and understanding that some have honest intent to move up and other don't care and want to just take up space.

But where do I fall into this. I want to ride, but to poor to race a full series. So am I limited to the Sportsmans class where weekend warriors run away with all the local events or do I just focus on the final standing and just go with the flow.

I think I will just look at final standings, not class structure and see how I place in final standings as a motivational factor to me. This is how I went from a nobody "Redneck" with a bow to a National and World competitor in the Olympic Archery sport.

This year was my first year racing as well and here is my take on it.

Go race your own race and only gauge your results against yourself, my opinion is that your first and probably second year at any particular event or series is for learning.

There is so much to learn: how the format works, what the course is like, where you can go fast with little risk, where it is better to dial it back, where does your bike setup provide an advantage, where do your skills provide an advantage, do you need to spend energy trying to pass a particular rider or is he going to wad it up in three corners riding over his head so save your energy?

The smart folks who have been racing the series year after year already know a lot of this. Given all that, actual placings and standings for your first season are basically throw away. If you get some knowledge but leave some trophies it's all good!

As to what class? Pick whichever one you think suits you and will let you pick up on things quickest.

I wouldn't worry about sandbaggers or any of that as you will have enough on your plate and things are different so much from race to race and series to series.

I personally jumped right to 30A, mainly so I could go off the line with my buds and ride the longer race with the harder course (C & sometimes B get different race times and courses in my series). So far I haven't DNF'ed or been DFL but reaching the middle of the pack consistently on my row will be an accomplishment.

There are guys on the 30A and 40A rows who make the top 5 overall regularly, but where are they going to move up to? Pro? Most of them have already been there and have other priorities now. When I get stomped in my class by dudes who are a few seconds off pro laps the only thing I feel is gratitude for being able to follow them for as long as possible and watch their lines and technique.

Looking at the overalls though I've consistently been at the top of the mid-pack and am very happy with that for my first season. Another thing to be happy about is if you can post up consistent laps or recover well from a crash or mechanical. There are plenty of small victories to celebrate on your way to moving up in the ranks and earning trophies.

Also, it sounds like you aren't wholly familiar with your bike and plan on switching some time in the near future, I'd expect to back slide a little bit then even if your new bike is better. Same goes for any major change really.

I think in the end it's all good and I'm super thankful to take part in a well run series (non AMA) that is affordable and has a great promoter. When it comes down to it grassroots off road racing is some of the most affordable racing there is and the people are the salt of the earth.

It's like having a second family you see every couple of weeks and gives you motivation to hone your skills beyond what trail riding might.

 

[12Bravo]

This year was my first year racing as well and here is my take on it.

Go race your own race and only gauge your results against yourself, my opinion is that your first and probably second year at any particular event or series is for learning.

There is so much to learn: how the format works, what the course is like, where you can go fast with little risk, where it is better to dial it back, where does your bike setup provide an advantage, where do your skills provide an advantage, do you need to spend energy trying to pass a particular rider or is he going to wad it up in three corners riding over his head so save your energy?

The smart folks who have been racing the series year after year already know a lot of this. Given all that, actual placings and standings for your first season are basically throw away. If you get some knowledge but leave some trophies it's all good!

As to what class? Pick whichever one you think suits you and will let you pick up on things quickest.

I wouldn't worry about sandbaggers or any of that as you will have enough on your plate and things are different so much from race to race and series to series.

I personally jumped right to 30A, mainly so I could go off the line with my buds and ride the longer race with the harder course (C & sometimes B get different race times and courses in my series). So far I haven't DNF'ed or been DFL but reaching the middle of the pack consistently on my row will be an accomplishment.

There are guys on the 30A and 40A rows who make the top 5 overall regularly, but where are they going to move up to? Pro? Most of them have already been there and have other priorities now. When I get stomped in my class by dudes who are a few seconds off pro laps the only thing I feel is gratitude for being able to follow them for as long as possible and watch their lines and technique.

Looking at the overalls though I've consistently been at the top of the mid-pack and am very happy with that for my first season. Another thing to be happy about is if you can post up consistent laps or recover well from a crash or mechanical. There are plenty of small victories to celebrate on your way to moving up in the ranks and earning trophies.

Also, it sounds like you aren't wholly familiar with your bike and plan on switching some time in the near future, I'd expect to back slide a little bit then even if your new bike is better. Same goes for any major change really.

I think in the end it's all good and I'm super thankful to take part in a well run series (non AMA) that is affordable and has a great promoter. When it comes down to it grassroots off road racing is some of the most affordable racing there is and the people are the salt of the earth.

It's like having a second family you see every couple of weeks and gives you motivation to hone your skills beyond what trail riding might.

VERY well said, thank you for the constructive response.

I am looking forward to when I am able to hit it hard, till them all learning and some more learning!

Thanks