sachs shock rebound prob

[wence]

G'day ,
Today I road a great little track which had just about everything, sand, hardpack, creeks , very tight single trail etc etc .
I was playing around with the forks and shock and had it about right .
I just did a slight adjustment on the fork and shock and did a quick lap and a half when the bike went weird.
Rear shock started to act like a pogo, no rebound damping.
Played around when the lap was finished and could not get the rebound damping to work, even to the extreme of fully in(still pogoing).
Had a rest and a drink and got talking about suspension and a mate told me to ride his crf 450 with suspension done by a certain tuer who does a lot of pros gear.
Got back after a lap and went to get back on mine and it wa shard as a rock.
Adjusted it back and got it reasonable for the last half of the day but was just wondering what the deal was?
Anyone had a similar problem with a standard sachs shock?
Cheers Mark

 

[noobi]

It sounds like the second problem here

Is your Sachs shock grunting, moaning or groaning? Did it turn into an expensive spring guide, like a BIG pogo stick?

Recently we’ve had some of these coming through the shop, there are 2 unique and separate issues that we have resolved for the Sachs shock. It isn’t typical to see both issues on the same shock and it isn’t common enough to condemn the whole lot of them and prescribe the repair for every Sachs shock that comes through our door.

The first issue is a horrible vibrating grunt noise emanating from the shock on the rebound stroke. You can usually change the pitch or harmonics of it by increasing or decreasing the rebound damping, you know, that adjustment screw at the bottom of your shock? It sounds BAD, really bad! Not to worry though because we have isolated the problem and have a proper fix for this, and no, it wont cost a body part to repair it. The charge is just a normal shock service. We’ll even kick in the 25 cent countermeasure repair part no charge, such a deal we have for you!

The second issue is a loss of damping, usually when the shock gets heated up. About 5 minutes into your favorite ride, it will act like a pogo stick! Let it cool down and all is well....... but only for a few minutes until it heats back up. You can try to increase the damping, but it isn’t going to help. Not at all. You have a pogo stick, you need to get it repaired. We have an updated part in stock ready for you, its about $20 plus the cost of a normal shock service and it won’t happen again.

http://www.lt-racing.com/html/sachssuspension_topics.html

 

[wence]

I thought I had read about it not long ago.Cheers Noobi.
So what is the deal and who do I contact as the shock has just been serviced?
Thanks in advance,
Mark

 

[noobi]

If it was me, firstly I would take it on another unimportant ride and check if it does it again to maybe confirm the problem like on the website then I would get in contact with Les at LTR and ask if you can buy the part. He is on here under the name LT-Race (I think), or just email LTR

But thats just me

 

[wence]

This was the second time .
I rode it at the same place a few weeks ago and the same thing occurred.
I'll give Les a call or an email.
Thanks for the help mate,
Mark

 

[bchatt]

My Sachs shock blew apart at 50 hours (07 EC250). The circlip that holds the seal and everything else in was driven outwards on rebound.
I took it back to the dealer as the bike was still under warrenty - they said there is a known fault with these shocks, they loose damping, and they suspected this blowout was a result of that. They fitted what was described as a "special rebuild kit" with a beefed up seal and maybe a bladder as well but I'm not 100% sure about that. Anyway, the main point is that it is a know fault and there is a known remedy. So far it seems to be OK - I'm at about 100 hours now.

 

[wence]

Spoke to Les and he has sorted it out.
Very helpful.As you say it is to do with the seal etc and is a known fault.
Should have it sorted very soon.
Thanks again must go to Les.
People like him make it a pleasure to own a Gas gas and be part of the gas gas family.
Cheers Mark

 

[bchatt]

That's great news. Did he happen to say what the fault is, and what the fix is?

 

[wence]

There is a problem with the seal in this type of shock. He has a replacement that fixes the problem.
Cheers Mark

 

[nick790]

I had this problem this weekend, what should I do?

 

[Skidad]

I had this problem this weekend, what should I do?

Well your in the UK so maybe start by contacting GG UK and see what they have to say. Hopefully they should have the fix for you or point you in the right direction. They better not try to deny the problem exists or haven't seen it.

I'm not chancing it for this season and just sent my 07 shock to Les for the full on LTR treatment

GG, Husky, and Beta must be getting great deals on this Sachs stuff. Wish they had just stuck with the Marzocchi (48 or 50mm please) Ohlins combo or even Showa or KYB forks.

 

[wence]

I had this problem this weekend, what should I do?

You could do what I did and find out what is available nearby for you from Les at Ltr.
He is a top bloke and would be glad to help you out.
Cheers Mark

 

[Klausen]

Your experience with the Sachs shock are not so good.
Also in Germany I read about loosing parts inside the Shock.
You know where this shocks assembled.
Is it still possible to order a new GG with Öhlins Shock and Shiver fork but also with crankshaft with bigger flywheel mass and enduro (not mx) ignition.

 

[webmaster]

The sachs shock is well built with a few minor glitches. Some of the shocks have issues and most don't.

Just an FYI - there are different "grades" of ohlins shocks - some with aluminum body and less expensive bushings, etc.

I like a steel body for longer service intervals and less shock fade. Like the older gold series ohlins - The sachs shock has a high quality alloy steel body.

Once the little glitches in the sachs are cleaned up - it is equal to the ohlins in build quality and ride. We have a sachs shock on our husky txc510 and love it (Les and I share this bike).

I was talking to Les @ LT-Racing the other day and he is talking about updating his website with details on what exactly needs to be done to the sachs shock to fix the issues that can occur with it. He doesn't want to give away his secrets and his business along with it. But he gets many requests for help from those outside the United States and wants to help everyone.

jeff
Webmaster
GasGas Riders Club

 

[WTEC]

Les needs a franchise in Canada There's gotta be enough euro bikes up here to keep a shop busy.

Wes.

 

[moto9]

I agree the Sachs stuff is good, I re-valved my shock and I'm very happy with it!
I opted to convert to a bladder...but that was a decision based on making maintenance easier.

 

[nick790]

The sachs shock is well built with a few minor glitches. Some of the shocks have issues and most don't.

Just an FYI - there are different "grades" of ohlins shocks - some with aluminum body and less expensive bushings, etc.

I like a steel body for longer service intervals and less shock fade. Like the older gold series ohlins - The sachs shock has a high quality alloy steel body.

Once the little glitches in the sachs are cleaned up - it is equal to the ohlins in build quality and ride. We have a sachs shock on our husky txc510 and love it (Les and I share this bike).

I was talking to Les @ LT-Racing the other day and he is talking about updating his website with details on what exactly needs to be done to the sachs shock to fix the issues that can occur with it. He doesn't want to give away his secrets and his business along with it. But he gets many requests for help from those outside the United States and wants to help everyone.

jeff
Webmaster
GasGas Riders Club

I emailed Les last week on this subject, but didn't get a reply. I understand that he wont make any money out of giving out information and that it must of taken allot of time and experience to gain the knowledge on the subject. I was just hoping he may have pointed me in the right direction. If he did ever consider, dealers or Representatives in the U.K. I would be glad to help.

 

[webmaster]

I emailed Les last week on this subject, but didn't get a reply. I understand that he wont make any money out of giving out information and that it must of taken allot of time and experience to gain the knowledge on the subject. I was just hoping he may have pointed me in the right direction. If he did ever consider, dealers or Representatives in the U.K. I would be glad to help.

Thanks. Les told me that he was getting alot of e-mails about how to fix the sachs shock & fork, etc. and he wasn't sure how to reply. If he tells one person across the pond then it isn't long before the info is impacting his business in the U.S. As the saying goes - "a secret is something you tell one person at a time..."

And as you said, it has taken him a bit of time to resolve these issues and test them in the field etc. These things have value to Les and his business - and if you give them away for free - they have no value. But at the same time - he doesn't want somebody in the U.K., Australia or NZ not able to enjoy their riding without fear of flying over the handlebars on the next big bump.

I talked to him yesterday and he hadn't had time to get to it yet - but he will be updating his website with specific details on the shock fix soon.

jeff
Webmaster
GasGas Riders Club

 

[moto9]

Thanks. Les told me that he was getting alot of e-mails about how to fix the sachs shock & fork, etc. and he wasn't sure how to reply. If he tells one person across the pond then it isn't long before the info is impacting his business in the U.S. As the saying goes - "a secret is something you tell one person at a time..."

And as you said, it has taken him a bit of time to resolve these issues and test them in the field etc. These things have value to Les and his business - and if you give them away for free - they have no value. But at the same time - he doesn't want somebody in the U.K., Australia or NZ not able to enjoy their riding without fear of flying over the handlebars on the next big bump.

I talked to him yesterday and he hadn't had time to get to it yet - but he will be updating his website with specific details on the shock fix soon.

jeff
Webmaster
GasGas Riders Club

I tried to buy a build sheet off Les but he declined, "totally understand"
Anyway, I know there's an issue with the seal in the seal head being able to float and this can cause the seal to fail over time...."not what your experiencing now".
Also, I know on my shock that some fluid was making it's way past the rez piston....another reason I converted to a bladder.
I went to a heavier spring so...I stiffened up the rebound stack quite a bit.
I could use even more high speed rebound dampening and the same goes for the forks.
If you can't get your stuff to Les, try a local suspension shop or tuner...a shock is a shock the principals are the same...Sachs is no different...then at least you have some one local to go back to for changes/tuning.

 

[webmaster]

I tried to buy a build sheet off Les but he declined, "totally understand"
Anyway, I know there's an issue with the seal in the seal head being able to float and this can cause the seal to fail over time...."not what your experiencing now".
Also, I know on my shock that some fluid was making it's way past the rez piston....another reason I converted to a bladder.
I went to a heavier spring so...I stiffened up the rebound stack quite a bit.
I could use even more high speed rebound dampening and the same goes for the forks.
If you can't get your stuff to Les, try a local suspension shop or tuner...a shock is a shock the principals are the same...Sachs is no different...then at least you have some one local to go back to for changes/tuning.

Please don't take offense, but as you will see shortly - the issues that you list above are not what hold the shock back and the next time you have your shock apart you may want to update a few parts inside according to Les' directions.

Bladder versus piston for the reservoir is a religious thing - Les doesn't try to sell anyone a bladder as he thinks the piston is more reliable. Alot of tuners want to use a bladder simply because it is easier to bleed the shock. And note that the piston ring weeping slightly is not an issue to worry about.

And a sachs is a little different than other shocks - Les knows them well and typically fixes three things inside them to improve reliability and action. Two of things he does are about to become public.... He won't even tell me the third thing he does....

jeff
webmaster
GasGas Riders Club