2011 ec200 piston kit
- Thread starter paulos
- Start date
Already tried that, couldn't find a partslist for the 2011
Jim Cook
Platinum Level Site Supporter
The only relatively inexpensive crossover piston kit that I ever found for the 200cc GasGas engine was made by Wiseco. It was designated as a piston kit for the 600cc three cylinder Polaris snow sled (snow mobile).
To the best of my faulty memory, the Wiseco piston kit is for a '96-'98 Indy 600 XCR snowmobile and the piston kit's part number is 2365M062500.
Good Riding and Wrenching!
Jim
.
To the best of my faulty memory, the Wiseco piston kit is for a '96-'98 Indy 600 XCR snowmobile and the piston kit's part number is 2365M062500.
Good Riding and Wrenching!
Jim
.
liv2day
Platinum Level Site Supporter
Digging this thread up from the past 
I need to do the top end on my '11 EC200 and haven't a clue as to what I'm doing as this will be the first dance (lol). I read through a bunch of threads trying to find some information and came across this one.
My jug is stamped "B"; I've looked at the Wiseco, Vertex, and Wossner sites and none of them even have the '11 200 listed. I might give the Wiseco folks a call at some point, but was hoping that someone on here might be able to provide some insight.
Basically, if anyone has the time to type up a response with exactly what's required to do the top end (aside from piston and rings); I'd be sincerely indebted. Sounds like I'll need the head gasket & power valve gasket - any other gaskets (base gaskets needed for this?)? I couldn't find a piston kit on any of the sites - what would the kit consist of (piston, rings, etc)?
Thanks a ton for any and all help...a bit nervous to be going down this path for the first time
I need to do the top end on my '11 EC200 and haven't a clue as to what I'm doing as this will be the first dance (lol). I read through a bunch of threads trying to find some information and came across this one.
My jug is stamped "B"; I've looked at the Wiseco, Vertex, and Wossner sites and none of them even have the '11 200 listed. I might give the Wiseco folks a call at some point, but was hoping that someone on here might be able to provide some insight.
Basically, if anyone has the time to type up a response with exactly what's required to do the top end (aside from piston and rings); I'd be sincerely indebted. Sounds like I'll need the head gasket & power valve gasket - any other gaskets (base gaskets needed for this?)? I couldn't find a piston kit on any of the sites - what would the kit consist of (piston, rings, etc)?
Thanks a ton for any and all help...a bit nervous to be going down this path for the first time
Well now this brings up an interesting scenario.
I see a lot of people doing complete top end r&r.
Typically you will have an interval or intervals between complete top end rebuilds where you are just replacing rings, and maybe a base gasket.If you use quality head gaskets and base gaskets you can usually reuse them if you install them with that intention in mind.
Its better for the bore and all the way around if you keep the top end freshened up by decarbing and replacing rings more often then running the piston and rings past that point.
You ride the bike a lot.It Isnt a garage queen.Something to think about.
I see a lot of people doing complete top end r&r.
Typically you will have an interval or intervals between complete top end rebuilds where you are just replacing rings, and maybe a base gasket.If you use quality head gaskets and base gaskets you can usually reuse them if you install them with that intention in mind.
Its better for the bore and all the way around if you keep the top end freshened up by decarbing and replacing rings more often then running the piston and rings past that point.
You ride the bike a lot.It Isnt a garage queen.Something to think about.
liv2day
Platinum Level Site Supporter
Definitely something to think about, I figure since this is the first time I'll be opening her up, I'll do the whole thing and then go from there as I'll have the experience under my belt.
I should have included in my original post that my bike has 110 hours that I've tracked, probably closer to 120 hours given the original owner only rode it a few times.
I've done some searching and found a piston kit on Fleabay (lol) that says it's for the EC200 with a 62.50mm bore (here's the link: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Wiseco-Gas-...1-/141172665072?fits=Make:GAS+GAS|Model:EC200). I have no idea if this will work with a "B" jug?
Thanks for the input, it'll be good to check when she gets close to 175 hours and then possibly just do rings. Newb question - but what do you decarb (and how)?
Tbucket
Gold Level Site Supporter
Jim Cook
Platinum Level Site Supporter
Basically, if anyone has the time to type up a response with exactly what's required to do the top end (aside from piston and rings); I'd be sincerely indebted. Sounds like I'll need the head gasket & power valve gasket - any other gaskets (base gaskets needed for this?)? I couldn't find a piston kit on any of the sites - what would the kit consist of (piston, rings, etc)?
Thanks a ton for any and all help...a bit nervous to be going down this path for the first time
To do the top end, I like to have the following:
piston kit (in case the piston needs replacing. Kit comes with rings, wrist pin, circlips, and piston)
wrist pin bearing (doesn't come in piston kit. I generally use a wiseco wrist pin bearing: B1003. It's the same for the 200, 250, & 300.)
base gasket
head o-rings
powervalve gaskets, right and left
5mm "nylok" locking nut (for the stud which connects the powervalve linkage to the bracket on the end of the powervalve. The bracket tends to be fragile, and the nut causes one no problems if it is heated with a propane torch before it's removal. I then replace it with a new nut upon reassembly.)
I leave the thermostat cover (the "T" fitting where the hoses connect) on the head, so I don't need to replace that gasket.)
I remove the cylinder and push the old rings into the bore, so that I can measure the end gap of the rings.
I always measure the end gap of new rings before I install the piston, and I recheck that gap when I am thinking of replacing them. (To me, that is the surest way to measure top end wear.) I've had new rings which had more end gap than the old ones I was thinking of removing.
Clean your powervalve while the top end is off.
You may want to replace the exhaust manifold o-rings during the job. It will at least be a good time to examine then.
I pre-oil the wrist pin bearing during assembly.
I don't oil the bore. I figure this helps seat the rings, and besides, the premix will lube it before the engine fires.
Good Riding and Wrenching to You!
Jim
.
Make sure you check the ring end gap in the upper, middle and lower part of the cylinder where the piston travels.The top of the bore may have a ridge built up at the highest part of the piston travel.Dont get to concerned about it and do not take a measurement there.
Make sure you have the ends of the rings where they ride when installed.You do not want them getting snagged.Use the piston to work them down the bore as you check, this will keep them level in the bore or trued.I like to work them top to bottom.
Uh you can decarbon the piston and cylinder many ways.Its intuitive, thats the easy part.Non caustic solvent of many types will work.Be patient, chunks of carbon are like hard glass.They will score surfaces.
Really better to have some one that has done a few topends do it with you.Its easy to overthink it and underthink it..
Jim, Ive read alot of your tech threads and you know your shit when it comes to bikes.Why do you check the ring end gap on rings you are replacing..I know theres a reason I just cant figure it.
Make sure you have the ends of the rings where they ride when installed.You do not want them getting snagged.Use the piston to work them down the bore as you check, this will keep them level in the bore or trued.I like to work them top to bottom.
Uh you can decarbon the piston and cylinder many ways.Its intuitive, thats the easy part.Non caustic solvent of many types will work.Be patient, chunks of carbon are like hard glass.They will score surfaces.
Really better to have some one that has done a few topends do it with you.Its easy to overthink it and underthink it..
Jim, Ive read alot of your tech threads and you know your shit when it comes to bikes.Why do you check the ring end gap on rings you are replacing..I know theres a reason I just cant figure it.
100 plus hours is too long.
If your jetting is spot on you can get away with a bit more but 100 as hard as you guys ride is too long.Its pay now or pay later, no way around it.,
Id say 80 hours between new piston and rings job.And new rings at 40 hours.So new top end then rings only at 40 ,new top end at 80, replace rings at 120, complete topend at 160 etc.
Good for you for keeping an engine log.
When I was racing bikes it was 20-40 intervals.
You can get away with a little more interval with cast pistons.
And they are easier on the bore.
I read that back it doesnt sound right but I dont know how else to put it.You get what Im saying?
If your jetting is spot on you can get away with a bit more but 100 as hard as you guys ride is too long.Its pay now or pay later, no way around it.,
Id say 80 hours between new piston and rings job.And new rings at 40 hours.So new top end then rings only at 40 ,new top end at 80, replace rings at 120, complete topend at 160 etc.
Good for you for keeping an engine log.
When I was racing bikes it was 20-40 intervals.
You can get away with a little more interval with cast pistons.
And they are easier on the bore.
I read that back it doesnt sound right but I dont know how else to put it.You get what Im saying?
2004ec200
New member
liv2day,
I just did the top end on my '04 200. I'm the 3rd owner of the bike and dont know when the top end was last serviced and couldn't find any info on the piston that was in the bike so I opted to do a piston kit. You may be able to get away with just rings. Cant tell though till you pull things apart and see what they look like. I also have the 'B' cylinder (62.46 mm). THIS is one for the B cylinder from Wossner (listed to fit my bike, if you opt to get one call and make sure it will work on an '11). I ended getting a 62.47mm Wossner from Nik Industries to adjust for wear.
Hall's cycle in Illinois had all the parts I needed in stock. They do have a Wiseco piston in stock but I got the Wossner instead. The Wiseco piston was a standard size of 62,45mm. The copper crush washers for the head are pricy at the dealer so I opted instead to get the closest size I could find at the local auto parts store and saved $30. I never told Hall's what brand I wanted but just what I needed figuring they would send all gasgas parts. Everything they sent was gasgas except for the wrist pin bearing which was a Wiseco. Parts arrived in 2 or 3 days.
parts to look at getting:
0.Piston (comes with pin and c-clips) or wrist pin if not getting piston
1.top wrist pin bearing
2.(6) head bolt crush washers
3.(2) water jacket to head crush washers (one is all you really need, the front most bolt does not go through to the coolant cavity)
4. inner and outer head o-rings
5. cylinder base gasket (measure the thickness of the one that you take off)
6. coolant drain screw fiber gasket (might not need it)
7. water jacket to head gasket
8. power valve gaskets (left and right side)
9. exhaust flange gasket. (its easier to get cylinder on and off without the exhaust flange on the head.)
I made all the gaskets I needed which saved a little more $$ versus paying the dealer. I think all I got from Hall's was the base gasket, o-rings, coolant drain screw fiber gasket and wrist pin bearing.
check ring end gap
you can make a piston holder tool to slide under the piston to hold it up while you install the cylinder. I used a 3/4" piece of wood with a slot cut in the middle so it will straddle the rod and sit on top of the cases and the piston sits on top of the wood. Lets you work with trying to get the rings into the cylinder without having to also hold up the piston. THIS video shows a metal version of the piston holder plus video will give you some other good tips to install cylinder. Measure your squish before and after to make sure things didnt changed drastically. Mine was 1.55mm before and 1.50 after.
Definitely take the power valve apart and clean it. Mine was a little crusted up and not closing all the way. I only unbolted the top locknut of the vertical power valve rod (never took the side clutch/water pump cover off). Just make sure not to pull up on the rod unless you want to fish all those Ball bearings out of your cases.
Hope this info helps.
I just did the top end on my '04 200. I'm the 3rd owner of the bike and dont know when the top end was last serviced and couldn't find any info on the piston that was in the bike so I opted to do a piston kit. You may be able to get away with just rings. Cant tell though till you pull things apart and see what they look like. I also have the 'B' cylinder (62.46 mm). THIS is one for the B cylinder from Wossner (listed to fit my bike, if you opt to get one call and make sure it will work on an '11). I ended getting a 62.47mm Wossner from Nik Industries to adjust for wear.
Hall's cycle in Illinois had all the parts I needed in stock. They do have a Wiseco piston in stock but I got the Wossner instead. The Wiseco piston was a standard size of 62,45mm. The copper crush washers for the head are pricy at the dealer so I opted instead to get the closest size I could find at the local auto parts store and saved $30. I never told Hall's what brand I wanted but just what I needed figuring they would send all gasgas parts. Everything they sent was gasgas except for the wrist pin bearing which was a Wiseco. Parts arrived in 2 or 3 days.
parts to look at getting:
0.Piston (comes with pin and c-clips) or wrist pin if not getting piston
1.top wrist pin bearing
2.(6) head bolt crush washers
3.(2) water jacket to head crush washers (one is all you really need, the front most bolt does not go through to the coolant cavity)
4. inner and outer head o-rings
5. cylinder base gasket (measure the thickness of the one that you take off)
6. coolant drain screw fiber gasket (might not need it)
7. water jacket to head gasket
8. power valve gaskets (left and right side)
9. exhaust flange gasket. (its easier to get cylinder on and off without the exhaust flange on the head.)
I made all the gaskets I needed which saved a little more $$ versus paying the dealer. I think all I got from Hall's was the base gasket, o-rings, coolant drain screw fiber gasket and wrist pin bearing.
check ring end gap
you can make a piston holder tool to slide under the piston to hold it up while you install the cylinder. I used a 3/4" piece of wood with a slot cut in the middle so it will straddle the rod and sit on top of the cases and the piston sits on top of the wood. Lets you work with trying to get the rings into the cylinder without having to also hold up the piston. THIS video shows a metal version of the piston holder plus video will give you some other good tips to install cylinder. Measure your squish before and after to make sure things didnt changed drastically. Mine was 1.55mm before and 1.50 after.
Definitely take the power valve apart and clean it. Mine was a little crusted up and not closing all the way. I only unbolted the top locknut of the vertical power valve rod (never took the side clutch/water pump cover off). Just make sure not to pull up on the rod unless you want to fish all those Ball bearings out of your cases.
Hope this info helps.
Ok, I read it again.A few times.
I get the idea.I dont ageee with it exactly.Maybe I am missing something and havent thought it completely through.
Too many variables.Maybe if you had 5 sets of new rings all the same manufacturer using the same manufacturing process from the same batch.All measured and calibrated to exact specs.Then you would have something to compare too.
You could tell what rate the rings were wearing, and then compare that to perfectly matched new rings and determine cylinder wear.
Their would be some usable information in doing that.
Still some variables in there.
Something to mull over tho for sure.
I dont think I have ever taken a top end down for a compression issue or any top end related issues and not replaced rings.
Except at the dunes.
I get the idea.I dont ageee with it exactly.Maybe I am missing something and havent thought it completely through.
Too many variables.Maybe if you had 5 sets of new rings all the same manufacturer using the same manufacturing process from the same batch.All measured and calibrated to exact specs.Then you would have something to compare too.
You could tell what rate the rings were wearing, and then compare that to perfectly matched new rings and determine cylinder wear.
Their would be some usable information in doing that.
Still some variables in there.
Something to mull over tho for sure.
I dont think I have ever taken a top end down for a compression issue or any top end related issues and not replaced rings.
Except at the dunes.
liv2day
Platinum Level Site Supporter
Big giant thanks for all the input and feedback fellas; really appreciate it. I'm going to call the folks Niks industries (thank you for the link 2004ec200!) as well as get all the other parts/gaskets/etc lined up and sent out.
I'm also going to grab a friend that's been down the road before...lol.
I'm also going to grab a friend that's been down the road before...lol.
Jim Cook
Platinum Level Site Supporter
Thanks for the kind words.
Now, someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the Niks Pro-X piston kit only uses one piston ring. That's okay for MX, where you are changing rings very often, but I much prefer a two ring piston and it's longer service life.
