hello new forum,01' ec250 .The old ongoing problem even with the LTR jets,Idles real high simmers down and peeders out since the bike was new.Another poster on the other site said to try a KDX needle.I have tried several pilot jets,the thing either screams or has some other quirky unstable result.Running champion water pumper oil @50 to 1,or 45 to 1 sometimes.I ride within a few feet of sea level.Otherwise the bike runs great. I guess i will order some needles and get agrivated some more unless someone knows another starting point.Thanks for any help-Don
EC250 Idles hardly ever
- Thread starter Rokondon
- Start date
roostafish
Gold Level Site Supporter
Sounds like you should investigate a blocked passage in the carb body to me. Nobody's needle will help with idle, unless you've cranked the idle so far up that the gas is pulling through the main jet for idle, which I've heard of, so make sure that's not happening.
Lean condition sounds right.
If the suggestions above don't fix the issue -> Depending on the amount of time on the bike, you might want to have a leak down test performed on the motor to ensure that you don't have a leaking crank seal.
Motion pro has a nice leak down tester - kinda expensive though...
http://www.motionpro.com/motorcycle/tools/2-stroke_leak_down_tester/
jeff
If the suggestions above don't fix the issue -> Depending on the amount of time on the bike, you might want to have a leak down test performed on the motor to ensure that you don't have a leaking crank seal.
Motion pro has a nice leak down tester - kinda expensive though...
http://www.motionpro.com/motorcycle/tools/2-stroke_leak_down_tester/
jeff
Hmmm,after reading these replies i think i will pull the carb off and check it more closly,and look at the boots.I like that pressure tester-too pricey though id rather just change the stator side crank seal.The seal on the clutch side would pull oil in and it smoke a lot...right?I did have one pilot in it where it would come to a normal idle from any throttle position for about 10 seconds and it would just go right to that barley running 150 rpm put- put for quite a while before it would shut off.Im going to mess around with it this weekend and i will be back to check forums too-thanks.-don
LTRace
Site Sponsor
Don,
Roostafish is right on track. When you look into the carb for any debris/obstructions and you are doing the cleaning, you will notice 2 discharge ports from the pilot circuit. The obvious one is the small hole in the throat downstream of the slide, the other is located directly underneath the trailing side of the slide. With the slide out, look straight down to the engine side of the slide recess, its there. Remove the jets and air correction screw, make sure both of these are cleared using carb clean and compressed air and verify they are flowing free. Clean the air correction circuit and while you are at it do the main fuel and air circuits too.
In addition to checking/replacing the L. crank seal you should check your reeds for any cracks or sealing issues while you have the carb off to eliminate other possibilities. Good luck.
Roostafish is right on track. When you look into the carb for any debris/obstructions and you are doing the cleaning, you will notice 2 discharge ports from the pilot circuit. The obvious one is the small hole in the throat downstream of the slide, the other is located directly underneath the trailing side of the slide. With the slide out, look straight down to the engine side of the slide recess, its there. Remove the jets and air correction screw, make sure both of these are cleared using carb clean and compressed air and verify they are flowing free. Clean the air correction circuit and while you are at it do the main fuel and air circuits too.
In addition to checking/replacing the L. crank seal you should check your reeds for any cracks or sealing issues while you have the carb off to eliminate other possibilities. Good luck.
futile efforts on idle
Yep,thats exactly the problem im still having.I changed the flywheel side crank seal(it was drooling but i dont think it was creating a air leak).Checked the boots to.I replaced the reeds with boysen carbon fiber pro,the old ones primary stage were not sealing-not laying flat.Took the carb apart for the upteenth time-messed around with pilot jets again too.It seems more adjustable now with the new reeds and it will hold a idle for a little bit but its not right.I took the left side PV cover off and started the engine and had it idling for 15 min.What the @#$$%!!!!!!????.Now i have the exhaust off and the other side of the PV apart and im watchin the valve work.Seems fine to me.Maybe too much back pressure with the turbine core silencer???-Naaaa cant be,or i would say probibly not i guess.I dont know im goin nuts.Puttin it back together for a South jersey enduro tomorrow-beat the crud out of it maybe that will work.Any ideas graetly appreciated-Don N.J.
Yep,thats exactly the problem im still having.I changed the flywheel side crank seal(it was drooling but i dont think it was creating a air leak).Checked the boots to.I replaced the reeds with boysen carbon fiber pro,the old ones primary stage were not sealing-not laying flat.Took the carb apart for the upteenth time-messed around with pilot jets again too.It seems more adjustable now with the new reeds and it will hold a idle for a little bit but its not right.I took the left side PV cover off and started the engine and had it idling for 15 min.What the @#$$%!!!!!!????.Now i have the exhaust off and the other side of the PV apart and im watchin the valve work.Seems fine to me.Maybe too much back pressure with the turbine core silencer???-Naaaa cant be,or i would say probibly not i guess.I dont know im goin nuts.Puttin it back together for a South jersey enduro tomorrow-beat the crud out of it maybe that will work.Any ideas graetly appreciated-Don N.J.
eff
Silver Level Site Supporter
It sounds to me you may be running way too rich and that's why it will not idle. My '04 didn't want to idle at all until I put the 38 pilot in. Now it idles great.
Another clue is when I broke the stock exhaust spigot. When this happend the bike seemed to run leaner and the rpm's were higher at idle.
Another clue is when I broke the stock exhaust spigot. When this happend the bike seemed to run leaner and the rpm's were higher at idle.
got it
your right eff-I put in a 40 pilot and new reeds that seat flat and its much better.I had a 38 in it but it didnt want to run right-after i put in the 40 i was looking in the 38 and it had some crud stuck in it!Ran a mudsliging enduro in south jersey yesterday and it idled enough of the time to keep me out of trouble.Im going to try the 38 again-how many turns should i start with the air screw?-thanks -Don
your right eff-I put in a 40 pilot and new reeds that seat flat and its much better.I had a 38 in it but it didnt want to run right-after i put in the 40 i was looking in the 38 and it had some crud stuck in it!Ran a mudsliging enduro in south jersey yesterday and it idled enough of the time to keep me out of trouble.Im going to try the 38 again-how many turns should i start with the air screw?-thanks -Don
This idling problem appears quite a bit. All the reasons mentioned will also cause an erratic idle, but from what has been said, it seems that its just the normal idle for everyone, then it drops to the putt putt level. After adjusting the float level, which was much too high in my brand new 2006, and putting the 38 pilot in mine, it will fast idle (about 1500rpm) for a few seconds and then drop down to silly slow idle speed and run a long time like that (very quiet like that tho). A blip of the throttle brings it back up to the normal idle.
If your bike leaks gas out the overflow when it on the stand or barely leaned over, your float is too high.
If your bike leaks gas out the overflow when it on the stand or barely leaned over, your float is too high.
Try a Mikuni
CDN,Im starting to think something is wrong in the design of the kehin.I think there are different slides available with a different cut around the air passage for the bottom of the slide?Or maybe the case induction gas gas design ports are to radical for a good idle?I dislike anything that dosnt idle it gets me pissed.Those trials bikes they make must idle or those guys probibly wouldnt ride them -right?My 01 ec250 is almost right but it still screws up and peeders out here and there.It likes to be super low or a tad to high.If i can get my hands on a MIC im going to try it unless i hear of a positive fix
CDN,Im starting to think something is wrong in the design of the kehin.I think there are different slides available with a different cut around the air passage for the bottom of the slide?Or maybe the case induction gas gas design ports are to radical for a good idle?I dislike anything that dosnt idle it gets me pissed.Those trials bikes they make must idle or those guys probibly wouldnt ride them -right?My 01 ec250 is almost right but it still screws up and peeders out here and there.It likes to be super low or a tad to high.If i can get my hands on a MIC im going to try it unless i hear of a positive fix
CDN,Im starting to think something is wrong in the design of the kehin.I think there are different slides available with a different cut around the air passage for the bottom of the slide?Or maybe the case induction gas gas design ports are to radical for a good idle?I dislike anything that dosnt idle it gets me pissed.Those trials bikes they make must idle or those guys probibly wouldnt ride them -right?My 01 ec250 is almost right but it still screws up and peeders out here and there.It likes to be super low or a tad to high.If i can get my hands on a MIC im going to try it unless i hear of a positive fix
Yes, my 280 trials bike will idle for hours and not load up or change rpm, but its a 28mm, not a big jug like on the 300. There are different slides and needles that will change things quite a bit. Search here (or I smackover) for more info. Its a fine line matching pilot and slide to get things working perfect in every rpm range and elevation, but you should get close sooner or later. For what its worth, I'm using the #7 slide,38 pilot, and N1EF needle for 1000' or less elevation. Its close and doesn't stall out idling once its warmed up. But it does do to putt putt mode after 15 secs or so of idling.
GMP
Active member
I'd also say its very dependent on the weather, and if you take the time to fine tune everything when the weather changes it will be consistant. My bike will ide well up to about 70 deg. F, when its warmer and more humid it stalls(at idle) eaiser. No big deal as response is very good and it pulls hard.
FWIW, I've played with the Mikuni on a Husky WR250. What I've noticed is that the air screw on a Mikuni seems to have more effect than on the Keihin. The bike stalls just as easy when its hot and humid in mid summer however.
The down side is that they are less flexible to tune. Les also told me that the Husky 250s run better with a Keihin conversion.
FWIW, I've played with the Mikuni on a Husky WR250. What I've noticed is that the air screw on a Mikuni seems to have more effect than on the Keihin. The bike stalls just as easy when its hot and humid in mid summer however.
The down side is that they are less flexible to tune. Les also told me that the Husky 250s run better with a Keihin conversion.
I was talking to Ron at RB-Designs about his keihin carb mod. He inserts a divider plate on the intake side - which, I think, would help the pilot circuit by increasing venturi effect.
I was talking to him about this and he told me that he also modifies the pilot circuit in the carb to make the carb work better. He wouldn't tell me what he does (it's his secret sauce).
jeff
I was talking to him about this and he told me that he also modifies the pilot circuit in the carb to make the carb work better. He wouldn't tell me what he does (it's his secret sauce).
jeff
CACTUSREID
New member
I went to a # 9 slide(leaner) from a #7 on my 01 ec 300. It really seemed to clean up the richness on the low rpms. think about it- have you ever had a bike thats to lean on the bottom end drop in rpms? start your bike,shut off the gas and you will get the answer to this quiz. i'm not a jetting wiz-just a guy that gets out and rides a lot,and gets the opportunity to try lots of different combos in real world conditions. try it,there is very little to loose here.
CACTUSREID
New member
Ron, thks for the explaination on the slide. It was the most noticeable improvement to my jetting issues ( way to slobering rich on the low end even with a 38 pilot in the bike). as someone on here mentioned though,as my carb has lots of hours on it, the jet needle may be worn out of spec. that aside,going to a leaner slide seems to clean up the bottom rpm range a bunch,as well as help the idle problems.
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