where to go from here. jetting q.

[stainlesscycle]

I think so. Remember I have quite a different needle, slide & carb to most 200 Gassers.

me too... 36mm/ddk needle/#5 slide...

When I tried DDK & DEK needles it idled nicely with a 42P.

and you switched to fej for what reason? was there a big flat spot or bog somewhere? mine is pulling hard with ddk needle, i've just lost idle when it's hot (once again..) it's still an experiment with the 36mm carb.

 

[stainlesscycle]

If your "idle screw" is the "throttle stop screw", then you are no longer using just the pilot/idle circuit. Instead, you are raising the slide and needle to the point that you are now getting into the "needle jet/jet needle" circuit by raising the slide with the throttle stop screw; effectively bypassing the idle circuits.

Jim

yep, i've had this problem with both the 36 and the 38 carbs. no matter what, once it's hot i have to get out of the idle circuit to make it idle. what is the solution???

 

[iancp5]

I need a different needle to be ideal.
I "think" (i.e. not certain) that with a xxK needle it shuts off the needle circuit completely because I can use a large pilot and get good idle. When I went to the xxJ needle it is too rich down the bottom but works well from 1/4 throttle onwards. I went for the FEJ because it would richen it up in the mid throttle which is what it needed. I chose it for this. What I think would work well would be an FEK but according to JD chart there's no such thing. So ... I will try a 35P and see what happens. If that doesn't solve it then I will try a completely different solution, maybe an EEM that looks like it could give me the leaness I want at 1/8 - 1/4 throttle with a 178M. The bike seems to want to be much leaner than on the 38mm at the bottom but then it wants to be similar to before after 1/4 throttle.

This is a bit like simulataneous equations - there's likely to be more than one solution.

 

[noobi]

I dont know if the jetting in my 07 200 is relevant but im running a 50 pilot, a 178 main, and some weird needle that iv never seen or heard of anywhere on the 2nd or 3rd clip, I 'think' its labelled NBHW ,but the stalk of the B carries on above all the other letters, and the W is really squashed up.
But it idles perfectly, hot or cold, and it seems to run very crisply.
elevation is sort of between 0 and 1500 feet, and say 10 and 20 degrees C in the winter.

 

[stainlesscycle]

ok, here's where i'm at now.

172 main
#3 needle ddk
42 pilot
2 3/4 turns.

appears to idle fine.. is consuming more fuel than before. maybe my float needle needs replaced..

 

[RBD]

The RB Designs head and carb mods really help the the issues that are being talked about.

Ron

 

[stainlesscycle]

yep, but i have the offset plug hole.....
you do carb mod on 36mm pwk?

 

[stainlesscycle]

172 main
#3 needle ddk
42 pilot
2 3/4 turns

sometimes i need to double blip the throttle to get it to overrev/get it to clean out.....maybe i'll raise the needle one more..


fuel consumption i can't figure out. needle and seat seem good. float height is good. bike runs great. but it's killing a tank about 30% faster than normal...

 

[gasser]

I was running a CCK needle in my 07 300. It cleaned up the bottom end and smoothed out the mid range but gas mileage dropped at least 10-15% compared to running a N1EH needle.

 

[stainlesscycle]

my mileage dropped the instant i switched to this 36mm carb. i had run ddk needle in the past on 38mm carb with no problems...

 

[iancp5]

Last night I went down to a 35P so I now have:
35mm PWK - 35P, 175M, #5 slide, FEJ needle on #3

It now idles fine but is still way too rich on the first little bit of throttle and then a smidgen lean until the throttle is 3/4 open. I think this means I need a leaner slide to get the first bit only lean. Whatever combination I input into the JD tool only a leaner slide gives me the curve I think I want - lean early then richening quickly. So I am thinking of a moving from #5 to #7 slide or is that too much?

 

[iancp5]

Reverted to DDK needle.

Now have:
35P, 178M, DDK on #2, Slide #5
Feels good in the yard so will try in a race next weekend. Not sure why I couldn't get DDK to work before - maybe because I had just rebuilt with new piston and things needed to settle and the copious amounts of oil used in assembly to burn off. We'll see. Have #7 slide on order and some strange needles. He who dares ...............

 

[stainlesscycle]

i put 3 hours riding in today. 1000ft elevation, 75 degrees f. 36mm carb.

172 main
#3 needle ddk
42 pilot
2 3/4 turns
#5 slide

is just about right. i might go to 40 pilot, i get a tiny bit of 4 stroking just when i blip the throttle from closed to 1/4 turn. otherwise it's perfect. great over rev, lots of power for the giant hillclimbs, no stalling.

 

[stainlesscycle]

changed to:


172 main
#2 needle ddk
40 pilot
1 3/4 turns
#5 slide

bike rips. idles great, has nice mild hit in the middle, good overrev. no 4 stroking.. plug color is correct...

 

[iancp5]

Rode the bike in a very mixed terrain enduro with the following:

35P, 178M, DDK on #2, #5 slide.

It ran well everywhere. But it wont idle! Back to this old GG issue. It was idling fine in the garage and yard but once it had been pinned flat out it didn't want to idle anymore. I have ordered a #7 slide which may be the answer as I'm already on a 35P and the airscrew about 3 turns.

 

[gasser]

Rode the bike in a very mixed terrain enduro with the following:

35P, 178M, DDK on #2, #5 slide.

It ran well everywhere. But it wont idle! Back to this old GG issue. It was idling fine in the garage and yard but once it had been pinned flat out it didn't want to idle anymore. I have ordered a #7 slide which may be the answer as I'm already on a 35P and the airscrew about 3 turns.

Funny, I've had 3 gassers (200,250, &300) and all idled very well - maybe it's your accent or that damp English weather.

 

[iancp5]

Funny, I've had 3 gassers (200,250, &300) and all idled very well - maybe it's your accent or that damp English weather.

What are you trying to say?

I think I have to agree. I couldn't get the 300 to idle either unless it was idling so high it made you wince when you selected a gear! They'll all idle for me for 30 secs but then it changes. I'll see what the #7 slide brings me when it arrives.

 

[Todd5774]

Its strange, i cant get my 300 to idle either for any length of time, 30 seconds and it dies, but being as its so easy to start it dosent bother me anyway as when i stop i tend to get off the bike anyway so dont need the bike sitting there wasting fuel.

 

[Jim Cook]

Its strange, i cant get my 300 to idle either for any length of time, 30 seconds and it dies, but being as its so easy to start it dosent bother me anyway as when i stop i tend to get off the bike anyway so dont need the bike sitting there wasting fuel.

I started riding GasGas when I became a dealer in 1997.
I never could get my bikes to idle without raising the slide with the throttle stop screw, until I went to a 42 or 45 pilot jet. I have had a #7 slide in my all my PWK 38mm carbs,

With a 42 pilot and the N1EG needle (clip in 2nd position), my bike idles very well unless the temps are close to 100F and I am working trail (at slow speeds with frequent stops, which elevate the operating temperature). Then, at these hotter operating temps, the idle speed will eventually slow down and let the engine die if I take too long to staple up an arrow.

The bikes idle much better with a 45 pilot, but riding in the mountains as much as I do, the engine stays more crisp coming off idle with the 42.

Good Riding!

Jim

 

[iancp5]

Well it beats me!
(I'm using a 35mm carb)
Rode an event Sunday and the bike was definitely too rich down low. As conditions were very wet I only used it down low. Luckily the lack of snap was ideal as it lugged beautifully but the point is, why is it too rich again. Something weird is going on here. I'm waiting for a #7 slide to replace the #5. Might replace the reeds in case they're acting up but they looked fine when I checked recently.