Dirt Rider 300 2 stroke shoot out

[StuJohnson]

Glenn
Not trying to get you fired up.
All bikes need tweaking...totally agree. But these bikes and motor are by far one of the best. No stinking magazine can tell me what to buy or not....Its all about $$ these days and of course KTM has a lot of it.

My bike's previous owner was Jeff Melik. As you may be aware he was champ last year on tthis exact bike and all he did was have suspension F&R re-valved and new springs, LeoVince muffler and different needle in carb....other than that the bike was completely stock!!!

 

[arminhammer]

Glenn
Not trying to get you fired up.
All bikes need tweaking...totally agree. But these bikes and motor are by far one of the best. No stinking magazine can tell me what to buy or not....Its all about $$ these days and of course KTM has a lot of it.

My bike's previous owner was Jeff Melik. As you may be aware he was champ last year on tthis exact bike and all he did was have suspension F&R re-valved and new springs, LeoVince muffler and different needle in carb....other than that the bike was completely stock!!!

Move the clip one position on my Beta and got a second in vet b enduro after riding the bike for 2 hours before this race. Now has about 30 hours on it nothing but regular maintenance.
I could write a fairly large list of things that had to be done to my 11 GasGas.
Not knocking GasGas love the bike but when it comes to the little things they kind of slipped up.
I think people just what a bit of QC when they shell out 8 to 10 grand.

 

[StuJohnson]

Don't get me wrong. The Beta is a great bike. Awesome bike, but just like all new toys in a 6 mos., 1 year, 2 years it will have problems as well and people will be commenting how if they only would of changed this or done this... Unless you can afford to go and buy a new bike every year then that is a nice set up. Most people can't or won't or their wife won't let you do so.....

Yes - I would like an AL subframe but that alone is not going to stop me from riding my bike.

 

[roostafish]

If Gas Gas would fix the oil fill and put suspension on it that wasn't so confused, it would easily be enough to choose over ktm, but the ktm has all that, plus its easy to work on. Gas Gas is not. Had I made the team this year, I would have rented a GG in Italy. I still love the gas gas, but this year, the ktm was a better choice for me.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Jakobi]

As much as we all love our Gassers here, they are still an enthusiasts bike. They're far from mainstream and most of this is down to the quality control coming from the factory.

Just look at all the little qwerks they have. Powervalve tension/rattles, excessive squish clearances, water pump clearance issues, jetting that is not only off but waaay out of the field.. The number of different tools required to work on the bike.. Not to mention the latest deal with Wes' 200R. The total lack of documentation, typos in the owners manual, an outdated workshop manual with incorrect torque specifications.. the list goes on.

I love tinkering and knowing my bike inside out. I love the way it runs and rides, but I also know that not everyone wants to have to participate on a forum in order to make their new bike run right. This is where the other bikes blow GG away. They just spend the rest of their time trying to get their bikes feeling more like a well setup gasser. Hahah.

 

[singletracker]

I have to agree that there are too many QC ?ssues with the GG. Things like a weak kick start lever, air box fit to carb, PV adjustment, and other well documented issues. On the other hand I won a championship on it with the stock suspension and engine. Luckily enough, the first ride after the end of the season my shifter shaft broke during normal riding.

It's a great platform that needs a bit of refinement to keep me coming back. It's great to have so many bikes to choose from.

 

[Vindicator]

... plus its easy to work on. Gas Gas is not.

The only thing I miss from my former pumpkin. I'm quite certain KTM must be the easiest bike to work on. Still love my GG though

 

[GMP]

The '12+ GG is a bit easier to work on. Shock comes out the bottom fairly easy and there are a few more captive fasteners. Frame tabs make skid plate R&R very easy. Filter changes with the new subframe are easier now as well. Routine maintanence is really not one of my issues with the bike. More major services like linkage, swingarm, etc. are slower for sure, but are not neccessary that often either.

 

[Neil E.]

This is my first bike with a perimeter frame and I didn't know what to expect. I like this layout for general access. My number one gripe with the bike is the pitiful "air box". It's just a collection of random parts that cover the air filter. Damn thing should be a one piece molding with no seams and good top access for filter changing. Sure it can be sealed up, but it shouldn't need to be done by the owner.

 

[GMP]

Neil,

The stock '12 airbox really sucks and makes the '11 look like a submarine! You can't wash the bike in a normal manner without flooding it. Thats the biggest maintanence PIA of the '12 come to think of it, washing it. All fixed now though.

 

[StuJohnson]

When I wash my bike I just put a towel over the seat and it hangs over the gap and wash away. No water in my airbox when done. I also don't use a pressure washer...

 

[Jeff Melik]

I normally try to stay out of conversations on here but I thought that I would throw in my 2 cents on this topic.

When I come on here and read all of the "mods" that are being done to these bikes it kind of blows my mind. It seems as if there is a massive amount of time being spent trying to fix (or re-design in some cases) many items that are completely non-issues. I'm glad Stu brought up the fact that he has one of my bikes and got to see first hand how little needs to be done to them. My 2013 is the same way; Pro-Action suspension, a Leo Vince and a few protection items. Any one who knows me knows that I am extremely picky about my suspension so I have spent a great deal of time in that area but that is whats important. Some may know that before Gas Gas I raced Yamahas basically forever. I can tell you that I had to do WAY more stuff to them to get them race ready than any Gas Gas.

I get questions all the time about how I fixed this or whats my setup on that and 9 times out of ten my answer is "however it came stock."

 

[GMP]

Well, with all due respect, if the '12 was good enough it would not have gone through two design changes in one year with regard to the subframe/tail section. Also, I have been pretty quiet about many specifics with my bike out of respect, and not wanting to create a panic early on. I quietly dealt with the problems, most with help and support from our excellent importer and and a great dealer. Let me just say this Jeff, if you had my bike and just rode it basically stock with a revalve/respring, you would have had some problems and a much tougher time with that '12 championship. Its got nothing to do with suspension or performance, GGs have always been designed as woods racers. It has everything to do with reliability and longevity, especially if your going to keep the bike longer than a single race season.

Stu,

Do you know how many PMs and emails I get from guys asking how to improve that airbox, or how to stop the filter from getting soaked from a normal wash? Its not just me! I don't know what kind of mud you ride in, but sometimes a towel on the seat is not going to make it! I do not pressure wash either, but you cannot even hit the side of the subframe spars with a hose. Remove the seat and take a close look at the airbox, and compare it to a more conventional layout, like an '11 GG. It will be obvious.

 

[StuJohnson]

Great comment Jeff!!
I have to admit when I got Jeff's 2012 I was on this forum and trying to figure out what I could do different and re-design... Then the more I got to know the bike and let it do it's thung I realized it does not need much extra work at all.

The Suspension alone that Jeff had done at Pro-Action is absolutely amazing. My last 50 mile single track in the Cascade Mtns which is rutted out, water crossing tjrough large rocks, trail covered with rocks and tree roots....I just stayed on gas and suspension soaked it all up!! I don't know exactly what all new valving Pro-Action did but whatever it is it is $$$ well spent.

My mods...
Motosportz Damper... I won't ride without one. If you rode these trails you would understand.
LeoVince muffler. Jeff highly recommended it. When I got it it had the FMF. Rode 2 times with that. Ordered LV and the bike came alive.
Water pump. new cover and impeller from Mark. Was it actually necessary??? probably not as Jeff raced an entire season without problems. But I did anyway...No charge involved.
S3 - 23oz flywheel weight... I had to tame the hit a bit for me. I live it!!
Top seat bolt access mount...again not necessary but I wanted it that way.
New rear brake fluid...maintenance item
Rekluse Core 2.0 Exp... again nit necessary for all riders

Other than that this bike is AWESOME and flows through the trails and terrain like a machine!!

I ride with mainly Honda's and KTM's... They all drool over it. My best bud who rides KTM 300 2T hopped and rode it a while...came back hopped off and said "holy siht that bike is awesome...the low end torque is amazing....ans the Suspension...WOW!!!

 

[StuJohnson]

Well, with all due respect, if the '12 was good enough it would not have gone through two design changes in one year with regard to the subframe/tail section. Also, I have been pretty quiet about many specifics with my bike out of respect, and not wanting to create a panic early on. I quietly dealt with the problems, most with help and support from our excellent importer and and a great dealer. Let me just say this Jeff, if you had my bike and just rode it basically stock with a revalve/respring, you would have had some problems and a much tougher time with that '12 championship. Its got nothing to do with suspension or performance, GGs have always been designed as woods racers. It has everything to do with reliability and longevity, especially if your going to keep the bike longer than a single race season.

Stu,

Do you know how many PMs and emails I get from guys asking how to improve that airbox, or how to stop the filter from getting soaked from a normal wash? Its not just me! I don't know what kind of mud you ride in, but sometimes a towel on the seat is not going to make it! I do not pressure wash either, but you cannot even hit the side of the subframe spars with a hose. Remove the seat and take a close look at the airbox, and compare it to a more conventional layout, like an '11 GG. It will be obvious.

Glenn
I am not going to turn this into an argument. Not worth it.
As you are aware I live in Western WA.... Yes it rains here and yes the Cascade Mtns receive over 6' of snow in the winter mos.... So yes we have mud!!!

 

[Jeff Melik]

On that note I guess ill throw in one more cent.

Motorcycles are not submarines. I personally don't think an air-box that is watertight is a great idea. so when water does get in where does it go? In the carb? Getting water on the air filter when the bike gets washed is a non issue because every time the bike gets washed it should be getting a fresh filter anyway. I have raced and ridden in more water and mud than most people would imagine (I am from Ohio after all) and never one time did anything make it past the filter.

That makes 3 cents now and I am out of pocket change.

 

[GMP]

Watertight on the sides, yes, why not?

Watertight on the bottom, no, it must drain anything that gets in. Thats why that rubber duckbill must go, it clogs. Buddy washed his stock '12 250 in a normal manner like any other bike. Noticed airbox full of water to bottom of filter. Drained over a cup of water from motor using the crank drain. Never had a chance to change filter.

I've got better things to do too. Good luck in the rest of the ECEA series.

 

[coopernicus]

Bringing the topic back to the Dirt Rider comparison: I read the article last night and have my own opinion. I read it as they kind of liked the bike except for some things that they thought were very important to address. Everything they said was at one time or another a thread from this website and they are all legitimate. I believe they were just telling GG what they needed to address for future model years mainly weight, suspension, and airbox. I would like nothing better for them to lose 10 pounds and gain some suspension consistency (sometimes it works great, others not so much). I would even go so far as to say that DR did exactly what was desired by some folks: Point out the flaws for the factory to get some attention to those details.

 

[Rick]

Bringing the topic back to the Dirt Rider comparison: I read the article last night and have my own opinion. I read it as they kind of liked the bike except for some things that they thought were very important to address. Everything they said was at one time or another a thread from this website and they are all legitimate. I believe they were just telling GG what they needed to address for future model years mainly weight, suspension, and airbox. I would like nothing better for them to lose 10 pounds and gain some suspension consistency (sometimes it works great, others not so much). I would even go so far as to say that DR did exactly what was desired by some folks: Point out the flaws for the factory to get some attention to those details.

Very good points..... we are not alone here Are we?

 

[rosco]

I work on everybody elses bike for a living so my bike doesn't always get the attention that it needs. The last thing I want to do at the end of the day after working on bikes all day is roll mine out and work on it. If something breaks I fix it and I do the general maintenance that is needed to go riding or racing. I have rode alot of different brands over the years [mostly yamaha's].
This will be my third year on a Gas Gas now and I'll have to admit, it sure seems like I do alot less maintenance than I use to. I guess if a guy wants to get nit picky you can find all sorts of problems with every bike but as long as all the major mechanical component's are sound I just ride the damn thing.
I have never owned a bike that the air filter didn't get wet when I washed it. But I am a pressure washer kinda guy. I like to pull up to the car wash and just blast the hell out of her and get it over with. I figure as long as you are careful arround the area's that are prone to getting damaged by the water pressure it'll be ok. We have gumbo here so a bucket of hot soapy water, a garden hose and a scrub brush just don't cut it.
30 years ago I use to love to sit arround with the guys and have a few beers while working on our bikes but those days are over. Don't get me wrong I still like drinking beer just not the working on the bike part. Ha!